Need ideas for buffing humans - round 4: Proposal

Pug · Post by **Pug** » Sun May 17, 2009 12:40 pm

I do that as well!! My current catcher in the league had block then dauntless. Great for slapping down anyone that tries to make a break through!

besters · Post by **besters** » Sun May 17, 2009 1:41 pm

Hadn't thought of taking dauntless, but I have 2 / 3 blodging catchers in my MBBL team, so Dauntless might be the next skill to take.

purdindas · Post by **purdindas** » Sun May 17, 2009 4:29 pm

Armour 8 on the catchers should give a small boost if thats all that is required.

If they need a bigger boost you could try making them strength 3.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Sun May 17, 2009 5:23 pm

See, I don't like Dauntless on Human Catchers as much as on similar models. I love it on a Gutter Runner or Woodie, but the Human Blitzer is only one slower than the Catcher, and a Blitzer is often easy to free up with conditional blocks (an unheralded advantage of Guard with good MA; it's easier to knock guys off of a Guard player).

Besides, my D setup really leaves me only room for 1-2 Catchers (maybe 2 if I have a Side-Step Blitzer, as that lets me protect a nickelback). So Catcher skills come at a real premium. If I had to deal with good Chaos, or any well-run team with a ST4 ball carrier on the cage, it might change my strategy, and I might become a real fan of Catchers with Dauntless (it really works on a Gutter Runner).

If Catchers were AV8, Dauntless would be the #2 skill on my #1 or 2 Catcher. Absolutely. When you're not ballhawking with him, you can use a Block/Dauntless or Wrestle/Dauntless Catcher to mark non-Tackle killers much the same way as a SS/DT guy would mark a speedster. Even a Big Guy or ST4 player with an assist only has about a 43% (91/216) chance to knock him down (as opposed to 120 for a Blitzer), while against a Big Guy without Block the Catcher with one assist has exactly 50% (108/216) to knockdown (a Blitzer with Dauntless, for comparison, would have 58% (120) chance, comparable to his shot against ST3/Block, but with about a 12% (26) chance to skull). Note that the Catcher has a 1/6 (36) chance to skull out, while the Big Guy only has 1/27 (8), and TRRs are less useful on Dauntless than on a straight-up block: that's why Dauntless likes Pro. Unfortunately, Catch and Dodge don't like Pro. And at AV7, man-marking Mighty Blow is nerve-wracking.

Heck, I'd gleefully use a rookie AV8 Catcher to pin down a BOB, though I wouldn't want to put myself somewhere he didn't need an action to line up an assist, and I wouldn't be throwing any blocks. I sometimes do this now, which is why I'm such a big fan of the +AV rule. The price reduction would make that a little easier. I do have to say, though, that my earlier comment about its value compared to the +AV at 70k was ill-considered. I suspect that -10k is better on rookies and the break-even is 5-9 games (depending on injuries, SPP and winnings).

* In a perpetual league, +AV is better.
* In a fixed season with a postseason tournament...
up to 10 reg-season games favors -10k
11-12 is a wash
more than 12 favors AV
Open postseason (reg season is for seeding) favors AV
* In a low-skill tournament, -10k is better

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Mon May 18, 2009 5:45 pm

Plasmoid wrote:PS, I don't know how you develop your catchers, but I generally o for block (for survivability) and then dauntless, to use them as super fast blitzing threats.

Yeah, that's exactly what I did!

Even with just Block catchers are a decent running player ... it's easier than you think to half dice your way past a player and run in a TD (69% if he doesn't have Block, 91% with a reroll).

If people aren't using Catchers maybe that's why Human have such low win %.

mattgslater wrote:See, I don't like Dauntless on Human Catchers as much as on similar models. I love it on a Gutter Runner or Woodie, but the Human Blitzer is only one slower than the Catcher, and a Blitzer is often easy to free up with conditional blocks

Yep, but a Catcher can develop Blodge and Side Step on normal rolls. Also, I develop my Catchers for speed with Sure Feet. Completely different entity from Blitzer, who really needs to develop towards the blocker style.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Mon May 18, 2009 7:00 pm

I'm still remembering the agony of trying to down human catchers with stand firm (doubles).... It took an after-season Mighty-Blow-Juggernaut Werewolf (double-doubles) to remove their blight....

Eh... what was the question again...?

Pug · Post by **Pug** » Mon May 18, 2009 10:54 pm

Everyone should be voting for Halfling included on the Human roster...

swntzu · Post by **swntzu** » Tue May 19, 2009 8:40 am

I've always wondered why the orc team could take a gobbo and the human team couldn't take a halfling. Whether this is a boost or not is debatable.

plasmoid · Post by **plasmoid** » Tue May 19, 2009 1:03 pm

>Whether this is a boost or not is debatable.
Indeed.

But the ability to TTM, coupled with the ability to better afford an ogre on the starting roster isn't nothing - so I guess it is a boodt. Just a small one.

Lictor · Post by **Lictor** » Wed May 20, 2009 1:31 am

Of course it's not a boost.

Ogres are accustomed to throwing Snotling who weigh as much as a sparrow fart.

The furthest they could throw these walking chodes may as well result in a fumble.

plasmoid · Post by **plasmoid** » Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:23 am

By far the most popular poll.
Tweaking the catcher is the clear favourite buff, with AV8 catchers being a marginal favourite.
Runner up is adding 0-4 halflings to the roster.

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:45 pm

plasmoid wrote:By far the most popular poll.
Tweaking the catcher is the clear favourite buff, with AV8 catchers being a marginal favourite.
Runner up is adding 0-4 halflings to the roster.

Isn't runner up 80k blitzers (11 + 5 votes in 80k blitz / 80k blitz + 130k ogre).

4 Halflings is much more cool, though.

plasmoid · Post by **plasmoid** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:21 pm

Hi Carnis,
the problem is ofcourse assuming that those that also wanted the ogre price cut would automatically have just the blitzer price cut as their runner up option. It's likely, but just 1 or 2 voters who didn't would alter the order.

But I've come up with a pretty good solution, IMO

Catchers going from AV7 to AV8 is a 20K buff according to formula.
So giving it to them for +10K would be a fair deal.
We could then counter-balance that by knocking the blitzers back to 80K.
So in a way, it's a price cut without a price cut.
But both pieces would be more fairly priced

Also, both pieces would be 80K - just like orc blitzer/BOB. Ah, symmetry

In the end, the net buff would be the AV on the catchers.
And the 0-4 halflings, naturally.

So - it would look like this:

Code: Select all

0-16 Linemen   50K 6338 G   -
0-2  Throwers  70K 6338 GP  Sure Hands, Pass
0-4  Catchers  80K 8238 GA  Catch, Dodge
0-4  Blitzers  80K 7338 GS  Block
0-4  Halflings 30K 5237 A   Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff
0-1  Ogre     140K 5529 S   Mighty Blow, Thick Skull, TTM, Bone-head, Loner

bbdave522 · Post by **bbdave522** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:51 pm

Personally, I really like ST3 on catchers. It leaves them with an average statline plus skills. I don't care if it goes 7 3 3 7 70k or 8 3 3 7 80k. Actually, you could leave the blitzer at 90k and use the catcher at MA 8/ST 3 80k as your "price cut" (although I know that nothing is actually cheaper). That seems to fit the fluff that humans are all really average; all have ST3 AG3 (except the Ogre of course). I don't have much experience with humans, just basing it off the theory and off my other BB experience, mainly with Skaven. I don't mind Gutter Runners with ST 2, but it doesn't seem like human catchers, being only AG 3, need ST 2 also.

Talk Fantasy Football

Need ideas for buffing humans - round 4: Proposal

Which buff is most appropriate for the human team?