Which of the 4 elf teams are hardest to learn/use?

[lunchmoney]

Having a bit of a debate in my new league (lots of new players and a few vets) about which of the 4 elf teams are the hardest to learn.

I say Dark Elves are hardest;
the High;
Then Union;
and Woodies as cheat mode

One of the other vets is adamant that Dark Elves are the easiest to use due to 4 Blitzers and high AV.

Your thoughts?

[nightwing]

I'd say High Elves hardest, then Pro Elf, then Dark Elf, then Wood Elf as the easiest.

Wood Elves easiest because obviously
Dark Elves next because, as noted, 4 blitzers, decent AV, plus Witches, assassins to spice things up
Pro Elves next because of the amazing blitzers, catchers, and relatively cheap line elves.
High Elves possibly the best passing team in the game, have decent AV, M8 S3 catchers. But only 2 bog standard (for Elves) blitzers. No special stuff like wardancers or witches to spice things up. A good team, just not as good as the other elves. Weird- they should be both better and more popular just on paper...

[Valen]

I'd say High Elves hardest, then Pro Elf, then Dark Elf, then Wood Elf as the easiest.

Wood Elves easiest because obviously
Dark Elves next because, as noted, 4 blitzers, decent AV, plus Witches, assassins to spice things up
Pro Elves next because of the amazing blitzers, catchers, and relatively cheap line elves.
High Elves possibly the best passing team in the game, have decent AV, M8 S3 catchers. But only 2 bog standard (for Elves) blitzers. No special stuff like wardancers or witches to spice things up. A good team, just not as good as the other elves. Weird- they should be both better and more popular just on paper...

Agree 100% with all of this

[Babs]

I think the two elf teams with AV8 are a little more forgiving than the two with only Armour 7.

As such, I think it's a little misnomer that Wood elves are the easiest team to play with, particularly in a league setting, where a pummelling will hurt for half a season (most expensive players in the game...)

So my advice is to start with High Elves. Are they the 'hardest' team? Well, perhaps - but also probably the most forgiving. I'd say Dark Elves, but that involves knowing how to use several more difficult skills (being Dump Off, Stab, and Frenzy). Also - the High Elves four catchers, once they have a couple of skills each, are easily the best catchers in the game (along with the Pro Elves). However, please see this advice is very much speaking from a typical BB2016 league - where you will see at least two orc and two dwarf teams.

[Loki]

I think its also 'helpful' to establish 'easy to play' or 'easy to play well'.

If you had a complete noob - even just to Elves rather than BB - I would suggest that the list for easiest to play and win with would be different from easiest to learn to get the most out the team.

[Digger Goreman]

2nd edition elves, lessons reliance on spamag4... otherwise it's an academic joke....

[faust_33]

Easiest to learn, High Elves. They are a pretty vanilla team and similar to Humans, except no Big Guy.

Hardest to learn, Dark Elves. More tricky with their positionals. Harder for a beginner to construct a decent team. And then there is Frenzy on the Witch Elves.

I've actually never used or played against Pro Elves/Elven Union, so I'm not sure if they are more generic than High Elves or not.

Wood Elves I would put somewhere in the middle. They aren't too hard to get used to, but you have to know how to play a team with lower armor and high AGI. They also have a Big Guy, which can be another small learning factor for a new coach.

For a brand new player, I would likely recommend High Elves. Probably even over Humans, since they lack the Big Guy.

[spubbbba]

Dark elves are a tricky one as the main issue is that you new players won't know which positionals to start with. All the AV7 ones have specialist roles and can quickly get you into trouble. So if a newbie has free reign then DE are probably the trickiest, however if they look up starting rosters and go with 4 blitzers and 0-1 runner with the rest linos then they'll do ok. Starting with 4 block and mostly AV8 means they can fight a bit.

If we assume they newbie takes good starting rosters then I'd say pro elves or wood elves are toughest.
All that AV7 and over-using re-rolls means they'll be likely to lose players, often expenseive ones and having a bunch of loners makes it tricky.

High elves are the easiest in my opinion as all them have well defined roles, you have mostly AV8 and all ST3 and they are not too expensive. The only danger is wasting too many skills on the passing game.

[Aliboon]

I'd agree with what Spubba said - the question was which is the easiest to learn, woodies are the best, but with AV7 and expensive players, they can be unforgiving for a newbie. Same with the pro elves, but their NOS catchers make the passing game easier than for the woodies (although most veteran BB players would probably argue that no team should play the passing game, even if they are well suited to it, but that is a whole other debate...).

I'd say High Elves were the easiest to learn, they are an obvious passing team and with Safe Throw for the throwers, will be a lot more forgiving on interceptions.

Dark Elves are maybe the hardest to learn (as the rulebook mentions) as their witches can get newbies into trouble. They are not a passing team, but might be played as one by someone learning the game. The assassins might look cool, but aren't really worth having in the main. But as Spubba said, a four blitzer starting roster is strong.

[Darkson]

Given my appalling record with them (Block of Holding aside) I'd say all of them!

[Milo]

I think Dark Elves are both easy and hard to use. If you stick to linemen, Blitzers and the occasional Witch Elf, they are very forgiving. High AG and good AV and MA means they almost always have a chance to snatch a game away at the end.

On the other hand, Assassins and Runners are more complicated players. I agree to a new coach these positions may seem appealing but they actually require a significant amount of skill and expertise to get value out of. I think most Dark Elf coaches should avoid these players until they've played at least a season or two without them -- and by that point, they may realize that they don't need them anyways.

[juck101]

Dark elves are a tricky one..
High elves are the easiest in my opinion as all them have well-defined roles

Yes I think Dark are hardest until you become more expert at blood bowl. Frenzy on a catcher is a drawback for novice players. All elves are expensive and the DE squad cost the most in the game (13 players with all positions) so you need to purchase well over deaths to keep running. They are hardest as in the fluff they have a 'running' game and dont have ma8 receivers. Better long term but not when you dont know running is safer than throwing. (Why play elves if you dont want to run?)

High elf and wood elf are both very simple with clearer roles. The Woodies are better quality players but both are easy to point upfield or to hit with. HE Pro elf builds are essential dodge blokc first, so I think you cant go wrong with a 10 game build.

Pro elf and HE are not perfect, if you use your thrower for all plays your lineman will be lacking. Saying that the pro elf will develop ok with blitzers cathchers and elite throwers.

Woodies, if you are aware war-dancers are the best players in the game you will do fine. Just point the wardancer at any situation and occasionally use a catcher for something on offense. Simple. Buy a tree and you even have a big lump you might use to hold the line with. Cant go wrong skilling a WD, neither do they need the other positionals, so even a few deaths wont sidetrack you. Possibly cant afford the thrower which will help you to level a team without him.

So I agree WE: very easy to play, easy to build, easy to maintain
Pro Elf Union: fairly easy to play, ok builds, easiest to maintain
HE; more discipline needed to play, simple builds, ok to maintain
DE, hard for novices to play, fairly easy builds, horrid to maintain