Touchback

Cannatiaz · Post by **Cannatiaz** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 10:47 am

What happens when making a kickoff the ball bounces on to one of the recieving caches player, and he fails to catch it. Does this count as a touchback?

Thanks

-Mattias

narkotic · Post by **narkotic** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 10:54 am

No, a touchback only occurs if the ball ends up outside the receiving players half after kick-off (that means crowd and the kicking team's half of the pitch). If you can't catch the ball, it just scatters form that player and you start your turn with the ball lying in an empty square.

In case that the ball was kicked to a player on the LOS and he fails to catch it and the ball scatters into the other team's half then it is a touchback because the ball left your half of the pitch.

Kheldar · Post by **Kheldar** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 1:32 pm

Nice worded, nothing to add here.

MadLordAnarchy · Post by **MadLordAnarchy** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 1:50 pm

It seems that everyone asks this question. I have had around 20 different people in various leagues over the year and pretty much all of them have asked. I would like to see explicit wording in the rules using the above example to show that a kick-off that leaves the receiving team's half for any reason results in a touchback.

slup · Post by **slup** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 3:05 pm

If the ball scatters or bounces off the field or into the kicking team's half, the receiving coach is awarded a 'touchback' and may give the ball to any player in his team.

LRB 2.0 page 7 The Kick-off

MadLordAnarchy · Post by **MadLordAnarchy** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 3:56 pm

Page 7 of the LRB is well known and maybe obvious yet so many people ask the same question. People want to know whether they get a touchback after they have failed to catch the kick-off and it has bounced into the opposition half. We all assume it means that a touchback under those circumstances but where is the phrase "under any circumstances" or "including where a receiving player has dropped the kick-off and the ball bounces out of their half"? Every single person that I have taught to play this game has at some time needed clarification on this specific issue and I have taught a lot of people.

I don't mean to be condescending to a non-English native but Slup's intervention does not clarify the matter. It does provide a way for us to compare what is written and what is meant. I apologise if that sounds rude but it is not the first time that people have responded to my posting in a way which does not resolve the issue the way they think it does.

vtdoogie · Post by **vtdoogie** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 5:30 pm

Quick Note that is a little nit picky.

If you fail a catch what happens?

It SCATTERS away from your square. Thus it is covered, but many wouldn't think of the ball scattering from their player, but that is what it does. Yes the phrase could be more explicit, but if that was done throughout the LRB we would have one of those 500-600 page rulebooks.

MadLordAnarchy · Post by **MadLordAnarchy** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 5:37 pm

Yes, it is picky and yes I have never had trouble interpreting it myself. However, the thread was posted about that exact issue and it chimes with my experience where everyone seems to ask that exact question. It might just be that in my part of London, everyone is either stupid or trying to cheat (latter more likely) but they always ask.

I can understand the point of view that it might not be a touchback. In sports where a touchback exists, if a player from the receiving team touches the ball it becomes live wherever it ends up. Admittedly, most BBowlers don't have much sports experience so don't suffer that fluff issue but mine do. The BBRC are always clarifying things I couldn't care less about but someone has posted a thread here on something that does crop up in my leagues.

slup · Post by **slup** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 6:20 pm

No offence taken MadLord (excuse my bad english, i have only been taught the language for a mere 6 years):)

Even if you clarify things in more specific ways you still raise questions.
Just think of passing the ball.
It is written without doubt when you suffer a turnover, but this is the thing that raises the most question and creates a lot of confusion and doubt.

The problem is not the wording (well in some cases it is) but people not reading the rules themselves or remembering them incorrectly and then passing on their incorrect knowledge to someone else.
And the kick-off section is not read very often because it is not very complicated making people rely on their sometimes false memory.

I do not think that the rules on this issue needs any rewording.
Any misinterpretations are solved quickly (to my knowledge) by referring to LRB.
And although most questions in this forum could be answered by a search there are more than enough persons in here that are more than happy to answer them again.

Alesdair · Post by **Alesdair** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:33 am

OK how's this for a teaser...

The kick-off scatters to one of my guys on the line of scurmish, he doesn't catch it, so it scatters over the line into the kickers half...
Where his lineman catches it...

Is it a touchback?

I'd say yes because at the end of the 'scatters or bounces' it's out of the reciving team's half. But i'm sure the kicker would disagree with me in that situation.

slup · Post by **slup** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:37 am

His lineman does not have a chance at catching it.
It is a touchback as soon as the ball crosses the scrimmageline before anybody on the other side gets an attemp at catching the ball.

Alesdair · Post by **Alesdair** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:44 am

Now that would be a way to rule it...
but then i'd have the kicker complain that he should have to chance to catch it, because if he fails the ball could scatter back into the reciever's half and thus prevent a touchback.

passengerpigeon · Post by **passengerpigeon** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 1:48 pm

Alesdair wrote:Now that would be a way to rule it...
but then i'd have the kicker complain that he should have to chance to catch it, because if he fails the ball could scatter back into the reciever's half and thus prevent a touchback.

a touchback isn't when the ball ends up on the wrong side of the line after it stops moving, it's when it crosses the line at any time during the kickoff resolution.

--p

'Ed Basha' · Post by **'Ed Basha'** » Thu Jan 22, 2004 2:32 am

true. if it lands on my side, I don't get to roll to see if it bounces back...so a player on my side wouldn't get a chance to catch it, since it is by definition already offside

Cooper · Post by **Cooper** » Fri Jan 23, 2004 9:37 am

and what if my own player is standing in his half (due to quicksnap). Can my player try and catch the ball or is it also a Touchback?
W