Bouncing balls question needs answer to satify commish

[Sceadeau]

This question is blindingly obvious to anyone who's played bloodbowl under the LRB rules, so a simple answer of "yes" or "no" is not sufficient when answering. If you want to answer like that, just move on, i already know the answer.

I am not the commish, if I were this wouldn't be a problem...however, they've been playing this way for years and I just moved here. So I need something to back up my understanding of the rules.

When a player with the ball is knocked over, does the ball scatter once from him, or scatter twice? (The answer is once, but i need a proof)

The argument that says it bounces twice is straight from the LRB:

Page 12: A player who falls over will drop the ball if he was carrying it, and it will bounce one square in a random direction (see bouncing balls, pg 14).

Page 14: Bouncing balls: If the football is not caught, or the square where it lands is unoccupied (or is occupied by a prone player) then it will bounce. ...To find out where the ball bounces to, roll for scatter one more time.

By combining these two rules, they say the ball bounces once (page 12) then references page 14 (bounce it again once it hits an unoccupied square).

My argument for it only scattering once is the "see bouncing balls" section refers to a ball being in the same square as a prone player, so would only bounce once. An official post on the subject could help clear things up for my fellow players, or a reference to an official FAQ or whatnot on how it should work to clear things up.

[Lordred]

Page 14 refers to THROWING THE FOOTBALL
So on p14 (in connecton with p12) you have to cancel the first sentence. The "bounce" itself is declared.
"roll on more time" is connected to p13 where they wrote that you have to roll for scatter 3 times, if the pass failed.

And last but not least:
SEARCH for topics with the same or with a similar question FIRST before starting a new thread. So we don't have to say the same things again and again. Here are many many many topics with bouncing, losing the ball ect.

Greetz,
Lordi

[neoliminal]

This question is blindingly obvious to anyone who's played bloodbowl under the LRB rules, so a simple answer of "yes" or "no" is not sufficient when answering. If you want to answer like that, just move on, i already know the answer.

I am not the commish, if I were this wouldn't be a problem...however, they've been playing this way for years and I just moved here. So I need something to back up my understanding of the rules.

OK

When a player with the ball is knocked over, does the ball scatter once from him, or scatter twice? (The answer is once, but i need a proof)

Once.

The argument that says it bounces twice is straight from the LRB:

Page 12: A player who falls over will drop the ball if he was carrying it, and it will bounce one square in a random direction (see bouncing balls, pg 14).

Page 14: Bouncing balls: If the football is not caught, or the square where it lands is unoccupied (or is occupied by a prone player) then it will bounce. ...To find out where the ball bounces to, roll for scatter one more time.

By combining these two rules, they say the ball bounces once (page 12) then references page 14 (bounce it again once it hits an unoccupied square).

My argument for it only scattering once is the "see bouncing balls" section refers to a ball being in the same square as a prone player, so would only bounce once. An official post on the subject could help clear things up for my fellow players, or a reference to an official FAQ or whatnot on how it should work to clear things up.

It's the way I play, and the way every BBRC coach I've played against has played. It was played that way at The Blood Bowl in Nottingham.

I hope that's official enough.

[DoubleSkulls]

The ball bounces once.

The confusion comes because pp14 is talking about bouncing a scatterd pass - for that you scatter 3 times to determine where the ball lands and then (if no player is able to catch it there) again to see where it bounces to.

[Sceadeau]

Page 14 refers to THROWING THE FOOTBALL
So on p14 (in connecton with p12) you have to cancel the first sentence. The "bounce" itself is declared.
"roll on more time" is connected to p13 where they wrote that you have to roll for scatter 3 times, if the pass failed.

And last but not least:
SEARCH for topics with the same or with a similar question FIRST before starting a new thread. So we don't have to say the same things again and again. Here are many many many topics with bouncing, losing the ball ect.

Greetz,
Lordi

Thanks, chief...however, every searched result i had had all the same one word answers. I know the answer, I know how Fumbbl's client plays it, i know how it's played officially in sanctioned events, however I needed a very specific ruling for my commish. I know how to use a search function, I assure you. However, there is a propensity on this board to answer well phrased questions with monosyllabic answers...and that won't do in this case.

As for the rest of you who responded...I realize that's what it's referring to, but it's hard for me to make this case against players who've been playing this way for years. Again, it's the case of the rulebook not being quite clear enough on the subject.

Thank you for your responses, however, and I will bring this page to the commish and hope he sees it the correct way. If not, I'll be back to bother this thread again.

(PS -- If this was in the sticky FAQ, there'd also be no need for it to be posted here...my search showed it has been asked 5 times in recently tbb history, which means it is at the very least infrequently asked)

[Skummy]

You might want to mention to your commish that Neo is a BBRC member.

I've noticed that this type of topic often comes up because of slightly confusing wording in the LRB. Does anyone think it would help if I were to put together a common bloodbowl misconceptions FAQ?

[Lordred]

Would be a very nice idea!
It it tunrs out great, perhaps it might become part of the GW-Page =)
And if not, well, it would be a great help anyway.

[Ziggi Abschuss]

Skummy suggested a BB FAQ, which is an excellent idea. It is even more excellent considering that a good part of the work is already done!

What I'm referring to is the OBERWALD (OnLine BloodBowl Enthusiasts’ Reference With Assembled League Doctrines). If a FAQ were made OBERWALD would be an excellent starting point as most of the rules are written much clearer in OBERWALD that in the LRB.

I quote Oberwald v4.60 on Scattering the ball

2.14 Scattering the ball
If the ball is dropped, it scatters once from the square it was dropped in. If a player holding it fell over, then it scatters from the square the player fell in or was pushed back to.
If a player holding the ball is sent off (e.g. for fouling) the ball is scatters from where the player was standing when the send-off occurred, not from the sidelines as the player leaves the field.
If the ball lands on a player who does not catch it, then it scatters once more from that square.
The only occasions when the ball scatters after landing in an empty square are when it has travelled a long distance to get there, e.g. pass, throw-in or kickoff.

I and my fellow coaches in our league read OBERWALD like a bible when it comes to disputes or misconceptions on rules issues. Hopefully all of you who weren't familiar with it find it as useful as we.

Ziggi

ps. you can find OBERWALD at http://www.vision.net.au/~mhorton/oberwald or http://www.blood-bowl.net/BloodBowlOberwald.html

[Skummy]

Isn't the Oberwald out of date in a lot of sections?