200 TV Skaven team, what would YOU change about it?

[Porkus_Maximus]

I've been playing this skaven team on and off in Cyanides' Blood Bowl, exclusively with match making. For anyone unfamiliar with match making it's an automated system that finds you an opponent based on TV.

My team has made it to 200 TV (somehow) and most of my players have reached the point where they probably wont skill up for a while, allowing me to really get a good "feel" for the skill combinations that I've chosen. While I'm happy with the vast majority of my players I sometimes wonder how the team would play if different skills had been chosen, and I started thinking about how other coaches would develop the team. So if you could change anything about this team, what would it be? The only rule is that you can't switch out a regular roll for a double/stat roll. Double/stat rolls can be forfeited to regular rolls. Skills are listed in the order they were chosen.

GR: +MA, +ST, Horns, Wrestle
GR: +MA, block, Sprint, Sure Feet
GR: Wrestle, Tackle, Big Hand
GR: Wrestle, Dauntless, Tackle

SV: Guard, Mighty Blow, Piling On, Tackle
SV: +AG, Guard, Mighty Blow

LR: Kick, Block
LR: Wrestle, -MA
LR: Wrestle, -MA
LR: Wrestle
LR: Wrestle
LR: Wrestle
LR: No Skills, Niggling Injury
LR: No Skills

TH: No Skills.

4 RR, 8 FF, 3 Cheerleaders, Apothecary.

[Ullis]

GR: Wrestle, Tackle, Big Hand
GR: Wrestle, Dauntless, Tackle

4 RR, 8 FF, 3 Cheerleaders, Apothecary.

Nice team!

I'd chance Tackle and Big Hand to Sure Hands and Two Heads and Tackle to Leap. Then maybe lose the cheerleaders. Getting RR's or denying them to the opponent isn't worth them at that TV level.

[mubo]

Get a rat ogre!?
If you don't like them, maybe try and give frenzy to a wrestle linerat, just for a crowdsurf threat.

[TuernRedvenom]

GR: +MA, +ST, Horns, Wrestle
GR: +MA, block, Sprint, Sure Feet
GR: Wrestle, Tackle, Big Hand
GR: Wrestle, Dauntless, Tackle

While these are not really bad builds, they do overlap a bit. nr 1 and 4 are blitzer builds, of which I'd only ever build 1. Number 3 is a ball retriever but has tackle, he would have been better suited with leap or side step and block instead of wrestle. I only prefer wrestle over block on blitzing GR's.
I think you're missing man markers: Block, Side Step, Diving Tackle. This build is amazing to hold a weak spot in your defensive line or to temporarily mark opposing key players out of the game.
You're also missing Strip Ball IMO. Sure, a lot of teams will have sure hands but it's still usefull. A chaos team would be more likely to run the ball with a Chaos Warrior instead of their sure hands beastman vs your team (to counter the monster GR).

[Porkus_Maximus]

Get a rat ogre!?
If you don't like them, maybe try and give frenzy to a wrestle linerat, just for a crowdsurf threat.

The team didn't start with a rat ogre but I bought one after about 6 games. He was actually very successful and a credit to the team, it was a pleasant surprise because normally I do not have a very high opinion of rat ogres. He managed to learn guard/stand firm relatively quickly, but unfortunately he received a smashed collar bone from a rookie troll slayer about 12 games into his career. ;_; My team was around 180 by that point, and I didn't see much use in replacing a rat ogre by that stage. I definitely wouldn't buy a rat ogre now, because he'd push me into another spiralling expenses bracket.

While these are not really bad builds, they do overlap a bit. nr 1 and 4 are blitzer builds, of which I'd only ever build 1. Number 3 is a ball retriever but has tackle, he would have been better suited with leap or side step and block instead of wrestle. I only prefer wrestle over block on blitzing GR's.
I think you're missing man markers: Block, Side Step, Diving Tackle. This build is amazing to hold a weak spot in your defensive line or to temporarily mark opposing key players out of the game.
You're also missing Strip Ball IMO. Sure, a lot of teams will have sure hands but it's still usefull. A chaos team would be more likely to run the ball with a Chaos Warrior instead of their sure hands beastman vs your team (to counter the monster GR).

GR 1 just learnt strip ball after his last game, GR 4 is close to skilling up and learning it too.

Yeah, GR 3 is the player I specifically had in mind when I made this thread. I was intending to build him into a man marker only I just... didn't. Looking back I can't remember what I hand planned for him. Guess I got carried away and lost sight of the big picture. He wasn't going to be a ball retriever originally I know that much, I just ended up rolling doubles and decided that big hand would be a helpful skill, he doesn't have an optimal skill selection but I still feel that big hand is a credit to the team. GR 2 was going to be a man marker to begin with, but I decided that a 1 TTD player was too good an opportunity to pass up. I know skaven can chain push quite easily for 1TTDs but I wanted a plan B in case that wasn't an option.

Thanks for the input, gives me something to think about. I'm sure at least one of my GRs is due to die soon, so I'll be sure to develop the next one a little better.

[Ullis]

I think that the blitzer type GR is the most important GR that a skaven team can have. Additionally, redundancy is not a bad thing in a skaven team because it's not unusual to have to go into a match with only two GR's available.

Of the other builds, as outlined by Tuern, a man-marker role requires at least three skills (Block, Side-step and Shadowing or Diving Tackle) to be of any real use. Whereas a ball retriever type can get by with only one skill, Sure Hands. Extra Arms or Big Hand would probably be better but Sure Hands can get the job done and will be useful in offence as well and the mutations require doubles. Leap is a nice addition. The man-marker GR is also just ST2 so he'll be easier to get off the player he's marking with blocking.

This leads me into suggesting that a blitzer type GR can also function as a ball retriever as well. First get two or three blitzer skills (Wrestle, Dauntless, Strip Ball, Horns etc.) and then get Sure Hands. Pertaining to the OP I did not include Tackle as the other skills are better for the blitzer build.

Last, in my own opinion, Strip Ball is always worse than it sounds or looks. As Tuern pointed out, even if the opponent has Sure Hands, the Strip Ball GR will still affect his plans. First he has to use the Sure Hands guy as a ball carrier (so no handing off or passing unless forced to) and therefore his offence will be easier to contain.

[Carnis]

So if you could change anything about this team, what would it be? The only rule is that you can't switch out a regular roll for a double/stat roll. Double/stat rolls can be forfeited to regular rolls.

Great team! My change suggestions:

GR: +MA, block, Sprint, Sure Feet --> +MA, Block, Sidestep, Shadowing (less efficient 1turner, better defender)
GR: Wrestle, Tackle, Big Hand -> Block, Sidestep, Guard
GR: Wrestle, Dauntless, Tackle -> Block, Sidestep, Sure Hands

LR: Wrestle --> Swap one wrestle for dirty player, IF they've fixed dirty player to work after assists in cyanide's BB. Use on opponents MB/PO players and star ballcarriers/star bigguys.
LR: No Skills, Niggling Injury --> Sack.
3 Cheerleaders -> Definedly sacked

Rest of the team I would keep as it is. I think having one Block/SS/Surehands player with 9MA/4AG can be superbly annoying against almost any opposition. They need 6's or tackle to take him down, and even then he'll always step in the wrong direction.

Rest of the team looks good. The biggest difference in our play-ideals is I prefer my gutters standing, as they will make better ballcarriers/markers with block/ss than wrestle/dauntless. I also don't see the point in big hand. You've had poor luck with doubles, but the +ST/MA gutter runner more than compensates.

I'd also consider a rat ogre with guard+stand firm asap. Block if you get the chance.