Is it ever worth not scoring!?

[neverworking]

Statistically two recovery rolls instead of 1, given 7 KOs means not scoring will be the difference in less than 2 rats being available in the 2nd half.

At a minimum to pull off a 1 turner you can reasonably expect needing to do a pick up, a throw or hand-off (if you have kick, there is a good chance its a pass), a catch, and 3 GFIs (or 2 and block to chain push). even if you assume every action is done on 2+ with a reroll and there are no dodges (or hand off and one dodge) involved that's still over a 15% chance of failure. If there is a 7th roll in there for a pass or dodge it gets to about 18%. Kick-off results could change the odds a little, but probably not a lot. Quick Snap and High Kick would make it easier to OTS, blitz and perfect D are less likely to happen but make it much harder; the potential impediments from throw a rock, pitch invasion, riot and a handful of weather events probably balance it out or actually make it less likely to OTS.

So in the end, I'll take whats probably a one in 5 chance he fails his OTS and let him have his 2 extra rats for the 2nd half.

It probably is reasonable though to not worry about something going wrong and throwing every block you can before taking it in.

[Digger Goreman]

Not every thread is about why everyone ought to use the Necro team, actually.

I like the way Digger is ALWAYS pushing his Necros.

It is beyond old.

Yup, it's undead.

Thanks for interjecting some much needed levity, JaM....

Wanchor, amigo, it's bothering you enough to comment twice so please re-read and you'll find that I'm not promoting anything but the death of what I consider an easily over-the-top, Ag 4 piece.... Nuffle's Balls!, I don't care if a madly blitzing snotling kills the abomination... or even an elf (though one could only hope for a non-block, double-down and they both die!)... so long as the easy-greasy twit finds a skull staring at him/her in the mirror of the after-life.... Now, I will promote the Necro/Undead in sincerely hoping I get a zombie out of it....

Damned apothecaries....

[Shortarse]

score and get 2 rolls to get your ghoul back. With dice anything can happen and although likely a 1 turner is not garunteed also remember there is possibility you may roll a blitz on the kick off and get to scrag the gutter runner.

[Ullis]

I'd score, especially if the rats don't have any rerolls left. Even if he gets the one-turn score, you're still looking at equal scores at half time with the rats receiving. But one-turners are never guaranteed and I'd trade facing 1-2 (statistically) more rats for the chance to be 1-0 up at the start of the second half.

Or maybe leave it at Nuffle's whim and foul someone before scoring or hand off to a mummy at your turn 8.

[Aliboon]

Or maybe leave it at Nuffle's whim and foul someone before scoring or hand off to a mummy at your turn 8.

This I did! (the fouling bit anyway). Didn't get sent off so scored. Got a blitz too, but with the 8 men in a line holding hands defence, I couldn't take advantage of it.

I'll keep you posted on what happens (he got 3 of his 7 KOs back).

[Shortarse]

Or maybe leave it at Nuffle's whim and foul someone before scoring or hand off to a mummy at your turn 8.

This I did! (the fouling bit anyway). Didn't get sent off so scored. Got a blitz too, but with the 8 men in a line holding hands defence, I couldn't take advantage of it.

I'll keep you posted on what happens (he got 3 of his 7 KOs back).

oh well always leave at least 2 a square back in case of blitz.
Did you get your ghoul back?

[Aliboon]

oh well always leave at least 2 a square back in case of blitz.
Did you get your ghoul back?

I needed the 8 players in a line to best defend against the non-chainpush 1-turner, so no-one close enough to do the blitz! i'm afraid. It worked too, he failed the 4+ dodge (double 2) and KO'd himself. All that worrying 'bout nothin'... Bloody Nuffle...

My ghoul came back at the 2nd attempt. All his original KOs bar one came back, and his 1-turner is still KO'd.

[spubbbba]

Thanks for interjecting some much needed levity, JaM....

Wanchor, amigo, it's bothering you enough to comment twice so please re-read and you'll find that I'm not promoting anything but the death of what I consider an easily over-the-top, Ag 4 piece.... Nuffle's Balls!, I don't care if a madly blitzing snotling kills the abomination... or even an elf (though one could only hope for a non-block, double-down and they both die!)... so long as the easy-greasy twit finds a skull staring at him/her in the mirror of the after-life.... Now, I will promote the Necro/Undead in sincerely hoping I get a zombie out of it....

Damned apothecaries....

On a serious note I’d be careful of how you say this to new coaches.

Some of the posts I’ve seen from you in the newbies section could come across as being rude to someone who didn’t know you were saying it in a bantering way.

Bloodbowl is different from other GW games in that some teams are supposed to be rubbish and whilst there are teams that are clearly strong there is a lot less disparity than there was between 7th edition Orcs and Daemons in WHFB for instance.

So to a new BB coach cries of cheese might put them off posting further about their team, they may well have chosen races such as dwarfs, orcs or elves just because they liked the fluff or models.

Anyway, shouldn’t you be playing Khemri now? They totally outclass Necros in the “suckiest tier 1 team” stakes, heck even humans give them a good run for their money there too.

[Digger Goreman]

On a serious note I’d be careful of how you say this to new coaches.

Anyway, shouldn’t you be playing Khemri now? They totally outclass Necros in the “suckiest tier 1 team” stakes, heck even humans give them a good run for their money there too.

Perhaps... perhaps.... I did go pm (shortly after posting) and made sure.... Also gave me a chance to find out that he's not a noob coach... just new to us....

Unbelievable as it may seem, I really didn't want a team like Khemri to exist.... It has no "Raison d'être" outside of pure destruction and no amount of tinkering (besides a complete overhaul) will make it palatable.... Jervis using "king's privelege" in a most bone-headed way.... Perhaps even more heretical, I would've junked the Undead and just had the Necro team (maybe with a skeleton option?).... I heard the "life-challenged" fanatics went vociferously berserk when that one was intimated somewhere around the beginning of LRB5 or just prior to it.... Straight Undead could probably be fixed by losing two ghouls... Khemri... bury them back beneath the sand....

I've been gaming seriously since '76... so I find "fluff" very specious as a line of reasoning.... It may inform some choices, initially (and I'll give you that), but it comes down to effectiveness.... Short-term, high/overpowered out of the box: Just look at the majority of races in the recent Carrot Crunch.... What jumped out at me was the total lack of some Tier 1 teams... the 4th place finish of a HUMAN team (this was due to either a Superlative Coach and/or freakish dice.... I'd prefer the former and would like to know his team and tactics structure)... the 8th place finish of Necromancers... and having a Chaos Pact and a Gobbo team not finishing near the bottom of the pack.... Otherwise, people went for the powerful, with the intent to win.... Given the structure, the choices were highly "timmified" for the most part....

Anywho, typical of greedy w'nk'rs games, there's only a handful of teams that are balanced by simple design (like the humans) or their initial good has an effective counterbalance (necros)... some need a little help (undead and skaven come to mind)... over half are severely fubar....

Wow, that's a lot of typing!

Back on track/subject:

The answer seems to be, "yes" there are times when it's not worth scoring... primarily around denial functions... but most people (to date) are opposed to doing so....

[Spiky]

I think it's best to score, and at the worst go into the 2nd half tied 1:1 than it would be to not score and go tied 0:0

There's a chance that the opponent will fail to score in one turn on T8 anyway, and going into 2H 1:0 up would be magic.

And to Digger Goreman - if you want game balance you really should come and play Elfball

[Digger Goreman]

And to Digger Goreman - if you want game balance you really should come and play Elfball

Aye, but with my deep investment in BB... and my personal economy stinking worse than the local and national economy.... *Sigh*.... lol... I'll have to pass....

And, by the gods that aren't... "elf" ball....

But, yeah, one can only expect high quality from the Impact gang....

[Aliboon]

Well I scored and ended up winning 2-1. He missed the 1-turner, but 6/7 KOs came back for the 2nd half so he managed the equaliser, but couldn't stall for long enough to prevent me from getting the winner in the last turn.