Necromantic team looking for first two skills

ngoike · Post by **ngoike** » Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:12 pm

With a bashy environment I agree with guard. Kick on the zombie will help, but will be better when you have the other wight.

You only have 3 players capable of moving the ball, which is a bit of an issue for this team. I don't advocate avoiding ghouls, mv 7 and dodge is a big help with moving the ball. Pick up block and sure hands and you have a solid ball handler this team needs. This leaves you to develop your wolves and wights as offensive pieces, rather than having to put ball handling skills on them.

I really don't know why people who play necro have a tendency to avoid non-regen pieces? Used to be a familiar complaint with wolves in LRB4. Plenty of other teams have to deal with this, and the new apothecary rules aren't helping them. They're relatively cheap for the team, and skill back up quickly enough it shouldn't be an issue.

datalorex · Post by **datalorex** » Thu Dec 13, 2007 11:15 pm

ngoike wrote:With a bashy environment I agree with guard. Kick on the zombie will help, but will be better when you have the other wight.

You only have 3 players capable of moving the ball, which is a bit of an issue for this team. I don't advocate avoiding ghouls, mv 7 and dodge is a big help with moving the ball. Pick up block and sure hands and you have a solid ball handler this team needs. This leaves you to develop your wolves and wights as offensive pieces, rather than having to put ball handling skills on them.

I really don't know why people who play necro have a tendency to avoid non-regen pieces? Used to be a familiar complaint with wolves in LRB4. Plenty of other teams have to deal with this, and the new apothecary rules aren't helping them. They're relatively cheap for the team, and skill back up quickly enough it shouldn't be an issue.

I think it's because you can't afford to skill them up because you can't regen or apoth them. Some may see it as a waste of SPP's to skill up a piece that you can't mulligan with on the casualty table.

ngoike · Post by **ngoike** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:02 am

I have to be careful how i reply, since on a different thread I advocate not using golems on this team. So obviously I agree if a positional isn't pulling it's weight it doesn't have to be taken.

I would advise against fearing losing your players to such an extreme. Heck regen is still only 50/50, so it's not a miracle cure. Ghouls serve the Undead team just fine, where they have the same limitations but can have more of them

Now as a long term Necro coach let me explain why I think it hurts in developing your team. You only have 6 possible players that can move the ball with any decent ability. Working with the assumption that a great ball carrier will have block, dodge, and sure hands/catch you can evaluate the players.

Wights can do the job, but can only pick up dodge on a double. With them now having STR access, I think they are better developed with Guard, Mightly Blow and other skills. This is why no one is advising picking up Sure Hands on this thread.

Wolves can get these skills, and make a good ball carrier as well, with their 8 MV, no doubt. But keep in mind that they have to pick up all 3 of these skills. And if you roll doubles or a stat increase, you're going to be very tempted to slow this down further.

Ghouls, while fragile, build into decent ball carriers quickly. Pick up sure hands on one of them first, block second. Reverse it on the other ghoul.
Keep them protected ( in a cage ), block and dodge will protect them a fair amount. If they die you buy a new one and quickly skill it up to add these back.

If you find yourself playing Necro without ghouls I really advise trying a game or two with Undead. Without ghouls you're focusing more on bashing, and less on speed, the Undead team compliments that better in my opinion and you get mummies

DamianTheLost · Post by **DamianTheLost** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 1:09 am

Agreed!

I find the ghouls extremely valuable.

I placed block, sure hands (kick return/side step/sure feet next) on one, and Block, side step (diving tackle next) on the other. This way the can be used both as blitzers and ball carrier, though be careful not to place them in very vulnurable positions.

I think ghoul rock, let them die as they please, but usually you can keep them out of harms way

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:02 pm

I would take Ghouls as well.
But I would not start with them in a long league.

And I wouldn't take Flesh Golums in LRB5 in a short league or tournie.

Buggrit · Post by **Buggrit** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:17 pm

I have a blodgy were with sure hands who should now take on most of the ball handling duties... MA8 with blodge and sure hands beats MA7 with same!

TuernRedvenom · Post by **TuernRedvenom** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:43 pm

Buggrit wrote:I have a blodgy were with sure hands who should now take on most of the ball handling duties... MA8 with blodge and sure hands beats MA7 with same!

Yeah but ball carriers need to be protected and cannot be used very effectively to clear the opposition off the pitch. You gained a good ball carrier but lost a great blitzer on your own offence! Not a good deal IMO.

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 5:53 pm

TuernRedvenom wrote:
Buggrit wrote:I have a blodgy were with sure hands who should now take on most of the ball handling duties... MA8 with blodge and sure hands beats MA7 with same!
Yeah but ball carriers need to be protected and cannot be used very effectively to clear the opposition off the pitch. You gained a good ball carrier but lost a great blitzer on your own offence! Not a good deal IMO.

Agreed, Weres are too good off the ball to be developed as ball carriers.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:56 pm

PubBowler wrote:I would take Ghouls as well.
But I would not start with them in a long league.

And I wouldn't take Flesh Golums in LRB5 in a short league or tournie.

I'm gonna try starting without Golums (and with ghouls) this next season... but will miss those big guys up front, and on the wings.... I'm thinking PubBowler is right... take the Golums up front and buy the ghouls asap....

PubBowler wrote:Agreed, Weres are too good off the ball to be developed as ball carriers.

Can't agree with that... while one were got killed late in the last season, they are great scoring machines even with killer skills.... Both of mine were Blodge, +AV, Mighty Blow, Sidesteppers.... And still scored 90+% of my TDs, even with Ghouls at the end (though the Ghouls were making themselves known)....

DamianTheLost · Post by **DamianTheLost** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:50 am

.. and I still want your skill dice for developing players like that

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 1:19 pm

Damian, that's just one "10" and one double each....

I want to crush the dice of these miracle rollers who produce "11" and "12" on a regular basis for the whole team.... And our resident Wood/Dark elf who throws nothing but 5's and 6's when the heat is on....

Stat increases, mine or others, is a bad thing... but seemingly won't be addressed... *shrug*

ngoike · Post by **ngoike** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 5:25 pm

To be fair, i don't mean to say that wolves shouldn't eventually be developed as ball carriers, but if you have ghouls you can focus on it a bit later, which in the short term gives you more options on the field.

Ghouls can become your short term ball carriers, while wolves pick up block and dodge ( or something interesting on doubles rolls ) first. But then wolves who tend to keep accumulating SP at a decent pace, can start to also gain ball handling skills, giving you more options to choose from.

One other thing I've noticed, if wolves become your ball carriers right away. They tend to pick up most of the teams SP, since they also cause a lot of the casualties. Personally I like to get the SP spread out early on if possible ( this includes the wights, so you can get them some of those handy STR skills ).

DamianTheLost · Post by **DamianTheLost** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 8:47 pm

[quote="Digger Goreman"]Damian, that's just one "10" and one double each....

I want to crush the dice of these miracle rollers who produce "11" and "12" on a regular basis for the whole team.... And our resident Wood/Dark elf who throws nothing but 5's and 6's when the heat is on....

Stat increases, mine or others, is a bad thing... but seemingly won't be addressed... *shrug*[/quote]

Just kidding mate

Marlow · Post by **Marlow** » Sun Dec 16, 2007 9:32 pm

I think Ghouls are better for the team than Golems. The AG3 makes them good ball handlers compared to the teams Linemen. With six AG 3 players all with at least average movement the team can play a passing game or rolling cage.

Golems fit well as Uber zombies but I find it a struggle to even get them one skill since they never particiate in ball handling.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Mon Dec 17, 2007 2:39 am

DamianTheLost wrote:
Digger Goreman wrote:Damian, that's just one "10" and one double each....

I want to crush the dice of these miracle rollers who produce "11" and "12" on a regular basis for the whole team.... And our resident Wood/Dark elf who throws nothing but 5's and 6's when the heat is on....

Stat increases, mine or others, is a bad thing... but seemingly won't be addressed... *shrug*

Just kidding mate

Okey, dokey....