Mutation Skills for Human Catcher and Lineman

[Gimli]

Catcher: Hypnotic Gaze, its not as reliably as AG4 but great nonetheless. MA8 & blodge/SS stacks nicely with this.

Liner: Horns (Continue with Wrestle/Tackle). Claw without Block/MB is a lot less awesome than what a skaven blitzer can get.

I don't get HG for a ST2 AV7 Catcher. He would have a 50% chance to take away a player's TZs (less if there are tags on him ) for ... ? I'm having trouble envisioning a game situation where that would be helpful. Now, if he could gaze and then move, that's another story.

As for the Lineman, Horns is a definite option. But he's one point from his first skill, which would give him either Block or MB. Even if he were Block, Tackle, Claw, he would be a CAS machine.

Also, have tried Wrestle on human Lineman several times now and just don't see the appeal. Yes, they've taken down the odd Blodger, but their TZs are also gone. Tackle is a more appropriate anti Blodge tool IMHO.

[Khail]

HypnoGaze is great because it gives you easy access to the inside of a cage or creates paths where there was none before. It also strips guard away from an enemy piece, which is really frustrating to teams that don't have much of it. It's unreliable though, and leaves the piece with it hitable on the opposing player's turn.

It'll definitely scare your opponents if you have it, but I've had games with Vashir where it almost never worked, and he does it on a 3+.

[Carnis]

50% chance of an "extra blitz", no downside. Just dont try to gaze tacklers too often..

[mattgslater]

Hypnogaze is pretty darn good. On AG4, I think it's better than Stab, esp. on a ST3 player. But on AG3, ST2, with all the survival skills, my money says Stab.

Horns or Claw on the lino, can't go wrong. Follow Claw with Block and either Frenzy or Pro (not Tackle, unless there's a lot of high-AV Dodge in your league). Follow Horns with either Block or Wrestle. If you use him for eternal DL duty, Claw is better, and there's something to be said for Regeneration (not that I'd do that). If you've got injured Blitzers or lots of SF/Guard or some other LOS combination (Humans have many different LOS options), then I'd consider Horns over Claw, but both are good.

[Greyhound]

I think the option for regeneration is only there for that day where you roll an upgrade for your +1ST , +1AG, +2MV orc Blitzer (yep I've met him once!) and you really want to keep that guy in your team because he's super cheese.

Even then it's questionable. Maybe for a Kroxigor with Block and +2 ST... Regeneration on top of Thick Skull and AV9 can give him that extra longevity.

anyone else just go for mutations/stab/hypno gaze.

I recently played using Hemlock (star player with 2ST and blodge like you, but also side step, jump up and stab) and I would so anything to have him again. If you take Stab, do take Jump up.

Jump Up + Stab means that when you are on the floor next to someone (and stop denying it, it will happen), you can roll a die, and on 2+ you stand up, block-stab and there is 0 chance of turnover. Absolutely risk free.

[Geoff Watson]

Two Heads on the Catcher, dodge on a 2+. Maybe Big Hand, to grab the ball when the opponent drops it in a crowd.

Hypnotic Gaze on the Lineman. Sure it only works on a 4+, but doesn't cause a turnover and is great at letting you break into a cage.

Geoff.

[Wanchor]

Extra Arms or Two Heads on the Catcher, Horns on the Lino, to be followed by Wrestle, then Tackle.

[Grumbledook]

I'd take two heads on the catcher

it is going to be useful in every game while stab will not, diving tackle combos well with blodge and sidestep to not really need stab and is less TV

having a high movement guy who can dodge on a 2+ is a great thing to have on a human team

[Gimli]

Thanks for the many thoughtful suggestions.

I think I have to take Claw on the Lineman. He's one SPP from his first skill, which will Block (MB on doubles). I appreciate that Horns might be nice, but long term I think the Claw is going to generate more SPP. It can be used on every Block, not just Blitzes.

The Catcher is the tricky one. HG - not with ST2 AV7 thank you very much! Even if I roll the 4+ and HG someone, on their next turn they can activate and hit him.

Ditto with Stab, albeit I understand that there is a decent chance the other player might be Stunned (or worse) if the Stab succeeds. But if it doesn't ... .

I have avoided making my Catchers ball retrievers/blitzers. Rather, I have been quite conservative, and have played them as, well, Catchers, using them to score quick TDs, etc. So far, using them in character has worked out. Both are Blodge SS. One has Guard (and a Niggle, sadly). So it boils down to which of Two Heads and Extra Arms is going to reinforce their traditional role the most?

I like the idea of being able to Dodge on 2+. But I think I might like the idea of catching accurate passes and handoffs on a 2+, catching inaccurate passes and bouncing balls on a 3+ , picking up on a 2+ and intercepting on a 5+ just a little bit more... .

Think I might try a test game just to see what I think. It really boils down to, is being able to dodge on 2+ more powerful than the improved catching, etc.?

[Grumbledook]

well you can replicate the extra +1 to catch an accurate pass with diving catch

how many times do you roll to pick up, catch, intercept etc with the player in a game compared to how many times you dodge

you also have catch to reroll all the catching rolls

that is why I take two heads

[mattgslater]

Yeah, I was starting to come around to Grum's position anyway, but if you're not sold on Stab, then take Two Heads. The great thing about Two Heads is that his next improvement is guaranteed to be very welcome. If you take Extra Arms and then roll an 11, you'll feel like your mutation was blown on a second-rate Nerves of Steel. But if you take Two Heads and roll an 11, well, who can't find lots of uses for a 1+ Dodge? Ditto doubles. Extra Arms is nice with Nerves of Steel, so you'd never look back and it would all be okay, but MA8/Blodge/SS/2H/Guard? Now, that is terrifying. Also, this guy's already a point-hog. You're better off building him as a support piece, to help other guys score.

You might want to consider Prehensile Tail as a free (if slightly lesser) Diving Tackle, leaving you room for Pass Block, Shadowing or Tackle at the next improvement. But I wouldn't do that over Two Heads, unless you're just dying to get an optimal Shadowing and/or Pass Block player (this piece would be about as good as it gets). Horns is another option that merits some consideration; he's more mobile than your other Blitzers. But I wouldn't do that either; if I did consider it, I'd look at Diving Tackle to follow. To me, these are also-rans with applications.

[Gimli]

Thought I'd give an update on this topic. I chose Extra Arms for my Blodge SS Catcher, and Claw for my rookie Lineman.

Have now played two games with them. The Claw lineman KO'd a Stormvermin in the first game due to Claw - rolled 8 on the Armour roll. Other than that, he was BH'd for the rest of that game, and saw only sporadic action in Game 2 vs a CD team.

Extra Arms has proven its worth already, most notably on a key handoff in my second game where I rolled a 1 then a 2. Without the Extra Arms - failure. With it - play went on, and there was a TD the turn after. Also one or two pickups on a 2 I wouldn't have made otherwise, and one pickup in a TZ that was quite important.

So far so good. It would be nice to skill up the rookie with Claw - Block on Normal, and MB on doubles!