Orc Thrower? Is he really neccessary?

[bampf]

I was reading the recent post from the newbie orc player asking for advice, and I noticed a lot of people suggesting multiple Throwers in his starting line-up. This surprised me.

I m putting together an orc team for our next league and after much deliberation my roster is as follows:
1 Troll
4 Blitzer
2 BOB
2 Gobbo
2 Lineorc
3 RR
6 FF

I will mention that I really want to develop a thug bruising team, however I thought about it and felt throwers can really be a detriment to an orc team. I have no desire to develop any kind of passing game. I m of the firm opinion that orcs should rely on a pass only in times of dire desperation... we all know orcs will never be able out-pass 90% of the teams out there.

So Sure Hands is nice, it could save a TRR... but unless you want your Thrower to score (and I certainly don t want that) he s gonna need to throw or hand-off to a player without catch... thereby negating the effect of SureHands. To me it seems you are infinitely better off (at least statistically) using the guys you want to score to pick up the balls. It may cost you a re-roll (to replicate Sure Hands) but it saves you a pass attempt/hand-off which both have equal or higher chances of failure. Caging may be a little more constrained (especially when facing the Kick skill) but I ve found the speedier goblins work just fine as temporary cagers until your ballcarrier (preferrably a blitzer) reaches the rest of your beef to form a proper cage.

So, am I missing something? I say, if you re not a throwing team... why develop a thrower? One of the veteran players in my league predicted my doom when he saw my starting roster had no thrower. That seemed very short-sighted. Or am I being short-sighted. Opinions?

[grotemuis]

think of it this way, it's a lineman with usefull skills (but -1 av). he's geat as a ball carrier with his sure hands skill (which negates strip ball!). If you don't want develop a thrower just give him block on his first skill increase and develop him as you would a lineman. don't underestimate sure hands, you won't allways have enough re-rolls to spend.

[bampf]

I think if he was a lineman with useful skills I d be more keen to take one. The -1 AV though is huge for a team most interested in being bruisers.

Don t get me wrong, I have painted up a thrower and will probably purchase one after a couple games because he does have useful skills, but I just think he s over-used and over-emphasized in a starting team.

[neoliminal]

When your opponent has strip ball, sure hands is invaluable.

[bampf]

In a starting league though opponents don t have strip ball... and usually don t until well into league play. By then a blitzer can have Sure Hands along with his MV6, AV9, Block and any other skills he may have picked up along the way...

[Smeborg]

It's very tempting to take an Orc side with no throwers, and all AV9.

The Thrower looks pretty useless, just a Humie Thrower with short legs!

However, experience shows the Thrower(s) to be very useful in 2 respects:

- You need that Sure Hands in order to preserve Re-Rolls (and to enable you to burn a Re-Roll in a turn before attempting to pick up the ball).

- You need the Thrower(s) to develop Passing skills, so that the Blitzers (who would be the Runners in an AV9 side) can get on with developing bashing skills (Guard, Tackle, MBlow, Dodge on doubles, etc.).

Consider Dodge on doubles for the Orc Thrower too.

Hope this helps.

Cheers

Smeborg the Fleshless

[MickeX]

I find throwers invaluable on Orcs and Dwarf teams, to get the ball into a cage quickly.

Typically, I want a blitzer in the middle of my half, and two throwers towards the back corners. When the ball ends up in the back (mostly because of kick), it can be picked up and thrown to the blitzer, who immediately rushes up to the middle where he can be protected.

The first and main threat to a cage offensive is that the ball gets into trouble in the back field.

[Gus]

i think you need one and only thrower in a starting orc team, for the reasons mentionned above: picking a ball can be a nightmare, and it's always nice to be able to throw passes (4+ with RR for a short pass, not bad i say).

[Baron Ollie]

If your thrower is your anti-strip ball ball carrier, then having the pass skilll is invaluable as well... think of a ball carrier with sure hands (no strip ball) and dumpoff, with pass! Suddenly you have a cageman par-excellence! IF any one flukes out and breaks your cage, your guy won't lose the ball on a push, and he will toss it away to a free orc on a knockdown! Granted, the dump off may not work, but if the player has invested a ton in getting to your ball carrier, he may not have the players available to take advantage of the dumpoff, even if it misses!

[NightDragon]

When I started playing Orcs I had your opinion. My Orc team was the least successful team I have probably ever fielded. I think it is essential to use as many outlets for success as possible. Don't become predictable.

[Tim]

Imo Orc Throwers are a must. The great strength of the team is it's versatility. Developing a serious pass game early is useful as it will help you to win more games if you are urged to score 2 turn TDs. It's wrong that 90% of the teams pass the ball better, the Orcs are one of the better passing teams, only to the Elves and the Humans and Amazons are better, the Norse are on the same level.

In our league the dominating passing team in the senior range is an Orc team with 29 completions in 12 games (23 of them on their Star Thrower who picked up AG+ after the last game ... ugh!). No Elves and very unlucky Humans as opponents, but still impressive.

[DoubleSkulls]

Having the option of doing something other than running the ball is vital to the success of running the ball - because it divides the opponent's defence. Does he double mark the goblin? Or put another TZ in the way of the cage?

You are selling yourself short by not using all the weapons in the armoury.

[swilhelm73]

I find my orc throwers to be incredibly important.

I run an option style offense with my orcs generally.

http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=team& ... m_id=32051

One of the throwers is in the cage with a couple blitzers and the gobbo catcher either part of or near the cage.

If the your opponent leaps in to the cage, he's going 2D your choice, and even with strip ball a push won't make you turn over the ball. I have a blodge thrower too, meaning he needs double POWs to get a knock down. That's a 1/36 chance.

If your opponent throws up a tough wall in front of your cage and you don't have time to tear it down, you can still throw or hand off.

And if you are playing a really fast team that can threaten your back field, you can throw the ball to get it in the cage on your first turn.

[Skummy]

I find throwers invaluable on Orcs and Dwarf teams, to get the ball into a cage quickly.

Nailed it in one. Developing throwing skills will give you another way to beat a team (always good). But even better, you will be able to get the ball to the middle of the field where you set up the cage, even when your opponent has the kick skill.

[Matsu]

Another reason for a thrower - the THREAT of a passing game. Without such a threat (and a blitzer with the ball isn't a significant threat), your opponent can invest 100% of his attention at shutting down your running game. The great thing about the passing game is that it usually ties up 3-5 defenders downfield to deal with your 2-3 'receivers', providing you with numerical superiority at the LOS. Without that threat, then your opponent has 11 players to match up against your front 8 (11 players minus the ball carrier and the back of the cage).

Summary: Passing threat = Better Smashing