Pro Elf tactics

[pfooti]

A general thread for playing the new Elf team. I love these guys. So post away with anecdotes, hints, whatever. I'll start.

Game against chaos. I'm down to 9 players to his 11, he's kicking to me. Touchback (lucky me).

I knock down his ogre in the center of the midfield line. By doing that, I managed to sneak a cage to about 5 squares into my opponent's territory. My passer has the ball, he tosses to a catcher, no problem.

The catcher gets into the middle of the cage, end of turn. Oppo blitzes a corner and puts a TZ on the catcher, and generally surrounds the whole cage.

Did I mention that this catcher has leap and dodge? I leap into the only square not covered by a player with Tackle, dodge 3+, dodge 2+, walk into the endzone. It was a little edgy, but with a reroll and dodge to cover the leap and dodge and no GFI needed, it was okay. These guys rule.

[Fronko]

Me chaos dwarf, opponent pro elf.

Me receives first, kills 1 and injures 2 linemen first turn, rest of half lots of bashing and maiming. Second half opponent concedes and builds new team.

Fun game!

[pfooti]

Zoiks! That sounds like a beating. My elf team has had 2 "floating" MNG injuries for the past 5 games (each game I get 2 SIs). I've also had 4 deaths in 5 games. Luckily, my most recent game was against Goblins, so I managed to squeak out without any SIs or fatalities. But my next game is against a chaos team who has about 75 TR on me. Eep.

Tactics:

I keep finding more and more uses for the nerves of steel catchers. The big deal is that they don't have to dodge out of the oppo's tackle zones until after they have the ball.

When I played a dark elf passing game, I had to get my catchers (actually witch elves with catch) into the endzone and throw a long bomb from midfield, because they couldn't catch the ball in two TZs, so they'd have to get free before receiving the ball. If that failed, sometimes the ball would go OOB, and usually the WE would get pushed into the crowd.

Now, I can pass to my catchers even though they're in TZs, and they can dodge and leap away into the endzone. The real danger now is interceptions, but that is offset by the fact that I only have to throw long passes or sometimes even short passes (as opposed to almost always throwing bombs), so there is a significantly lower chance of interception.

Once I get all four catchers on the roster (only have 3 right now), it will be even better. Turn one, receive kick, fall back with the passer. Pass/blitz a hole or two in the line (there's always somewhere) and flood the oppos' backfield with more catchers than can be effectively covered. Turn two, score.

I'll post tomorrow about the (much more interesting and exciting) defensive game. That's my favorite part of BB.

[Fronko]

Yeah, from what I have seen from my pal, NOS on the catchers and sidestep on the blitzers in fact is a great combo. He ran them in pairs into the opposing half, the blitzer supporting the catcher. You could not blitz the blitzer away, so he always had at least a 1D block to free the catcher to dodge out next turn. And crowding them was just as ineffective, due to NOS.

The only real way to beat this team was actually to grind them into puieces. Which I did. Lots of luck on my side, I gotta say.

[Sharky2k]

i played the elves on the dungeonbowl. but in my opinion the blitzers not really needed. u can do all nice actions with the catchers. and the have str 3, thats also a nice one !
maybe i start playing the elves no in a league. really nice team. the catchers are awesome

[Longshot]

in a league, you better start without Catchers! those guys will take all the experience and you line will died each time...

[Barks]

I'm thinking of starting prelfs in the near future- the NoS catchers sound so appealing, as well as the 60K line-elves! I'm thinking of running catchers deep, using NoS for a 2+ catch and then dodging for 2-turn TDs. On defence, using the catchers to attack deep. So what's a good start-up:

7 line, 2 catch, 2 throw, 3 RR, FF9
8 line, 2 catch, 1 throw, 3RR, FF9, 10K in the bank
12 line, 3RR, apoth, FF8

I'm keen to stick with high FF and 3RR.
Suggestions and explanations welcomed.

Barks

[NightDragon]

This should be an interesting thread to me as I have little experience with these guys. Only really play DE's now, but like the the Pro Elf lineup.

[Sharky2k]

I'm thinking of starting prelfs in the near future- the NoS catchers sound so appealing, as well as the 60K line-elves! I'm thinking of running catchers deep, using NoS for a 2+ catch and then dodging for 2-turn TDs. On defence, using the catchers to attack deep. So what's a good start-up:

7 line, 2 catch, 2 throw, 3 RR, FF9
8 line, 2 catch, 1 throw, 3RR, FF9, 10K in the bank
12 line, 3RR, apoth, FF8

I'm keen to stick with high FF and 3RR.
Suggestions and explanations welcomed.

Barks

hmm 2 thrower ? not really needed. these are elves
or u wanna make all td with a long bomb ?

[Wonder]

Some advices :
- the blitzer is a must have. He is the only player able to suffer blocks (AR 8 and block helping) and sidestep is a very, very good "annoying" skill against non-AG team. If you put a ZT on the ballcarrier, the opponent will have real difficulties to get him out of the way and avoid the dodge.
- the catchers are as good as HE catchers (that is ... very good, MV8+ST3+AG4 rocks), but NOS is somehow not so good at the beginning of the team : it costs 10K extra (which is a lot for a starting elf team) and having AG4 and catch, you can afford catching in one ZT (3+ rerolled is honest ; two ZT being more a gamble). The main problem with the catcher is that you often send him far away in the opponent side, and they often get blocked and wounded.
- the lineelves are bad : too slow too keep up the pass play and to weak to stand the strong play. Having played woodies, I can tell how the MV7 changes everything.

IMHO :
- play as many blitzers as you can
- don't send catchers too far way, let them run with the lineelves first, and let them go only for scoring
- without any dodge skill at the beginning of the team, you'll nead some RR, 2 maybe 3
- with a high injury rate, get money ! So have a 6+ FF

evolutions :
- give dodge to your lineelves and catchers
- diving tackle on blitzers could be a very good option - and the usual tackle and strip ball as well
- consider some "guard"s on double on LE
- consider dump off on double on a catcher : this one will carry the ball and run along with his catcher buddy. Once he's blocked, he'll have no difficulty to give it to his buddy (NOS helping a lot) and with one blitz a turn, your opponent will be very, very unpleased.

A challenging starting roster :
- 2 blitzers
- 9 line-elves
- 3 RR
- 9 FF

A bit weak (11 and no apo), but the blitzers toughness and the big money will help to sustain damage. Use your LE to score or blitzers in tight situations.
As soon as possible, buy an apo, then gradually buy catchers and a thrower.
The RR should compensate your lack of skills at the beginning and allow you to take risks (long pass without pass ?).
Easy option, if you like passes : lose 1 FF and switch a LE for a thrower.[/code]

[DoubleSkulls]

I think I try to play them as a WE/HE hybrid.

They can't stand up to the punishment HE can - so Blodge is necessary on most players.

Develop your catchers as blitzers... S3 and speed mean that once developed they are very effective. I'd try to develop a blitzer as a War Dancer type (Leap, Strip Ball etc).

As normal for Elf teams Guard and Dauntless are priorities for doubles.

[erod4]

In a tourney i did fairly well with:

2 Blitzer
1 Thrower
1 Catcher
7 Line Elves
Apothecary
2 Re-Rolls
Fan Factor 4

If in a league I'd probably switch the catcher out for the FF to buy them later since they advance easily enough, so it would look like:

2 Blitzer
1 Thrower (worth 10K IMHO, especially for the bonus re-rolls he will undoubtedly use alot )
8 Line Elves
Apothecary
2 Re-Rolls
FF 8

[erod4]

or you could always save the apothecary for your first purchase and just pray game 1 goes well for ya and add the third re-roll

[pfooti]

The new Elf roster has a couple of interesting strengths that make it a very good team for playing an aggressive defense. They also have a significant weakness, the AV 7 on most of their players. A lot of these strategies will end up with your players getting hit, and therefore possibly hurt. So, a word of warning, don't blame me if your teams ends up all niggled. All I can say is that my team hasn't, although I've been losing one player a game to death on average. But I can be really frustrating, and it is usually the linemen that die.

Your players:

Your Blitzers are going to be your first line of defense. They've got enough speed to be a threat to just about everybody, and they're your only AV 8 players. They also have Sidestep, which is a really great skill. The first benefit of sidestep is kind of subtle: a lot of coaches don't have experience playing against side-steppers. They mess up and hit your guy, forgetting that he can just step ever closer to their ballcarrier. Put strip ball on your blitzers quickly. My skill progression is: dodge, strip ball, leap. One match, I had 4 consecutive turns where my blitzer would get up, blitz the ballcarrier and strip the ball, which popped free. My oppo kept managing to get the ball back, but every time he hit my blitzer, he ended up going down next to the ballcarrier, or on the ball, which would bounce into a different position. That sidestep can be really annoying. Sidestep also means you can stand next to the sideline if necessary.

The catchers are awesome backfield harassers, free safeties, and ball recoverers. With their speed, and the leap you'll end up giving them, they can get behind your oppos' play and pin down the back of the cage or run in from across the field and hit somebody unexpectedly. They also have an unexpected skill: nerves of steel. If you get the ball in a bunch of TZs (a tough task, but with sure hands and ag4, not impossible in 2 TZs), you can huck it out of there with your NoS. You'll probably end up developing some of your catchers defensively and some offensively. The defensive ones want dodge, leap, passblock, block, sure hands, tackle, strip ball. The offensive ones want dodge, leap, block, sure feet. So go and give dodge and leap as the first skills and then specialize from there.

The throwers are great, considering their price. They're worth getting two of. They're going to need safe throw more than any other team, since you'll be throwing over people all the time (what with all the NoS). It might make sense to turn one of these guys into a more defensive thrower, with dump off, sure hands and other skills to make him the guy that goes and gets the ball after it's been knocked to the ground.

Your linemen stink, compared to all the other elf linemen. But they're cheap. This means your opening lineup can have more positional players in it, and you can afford to replace your linemen whenever they die. As I mentioned earlier, mine die all the time. The fact that you have so many positional players early in your team's life cycle means that your linemen might have a hard time skilling up. Even though you really want to get a lineman to score a TD, you might end up passing the ball to the catcher, since he can score this turn, and your lineman can't without a bunch of tough rolls for which he has no skills (say catch, or extra GFIs).

You need money. Get a high FF. If you're going to be a power defense, you need lots of rerolls too, start with at least 3, you can afford it.

Actual tactics:

In general, the Elf roster is great with broken plays. If you manage to knock the ball loose, you'll be ahead of the game. You've got agility on most teams, skills on the others, and you can get to the ball firstest with the mostest. Put tackle zones on the ball, especially a blitzer. If your oppo decides to try and get the ball, you can use your sidestep to start a soccer match if you think it is to your advantage. If you're winning, consider a "punt". Pick up the ball and huck it toward your endzone as hard as you can. Don't worry about catching it, just get it far enough from your oppo's endzone that they can't score this half.

Against a passing team, you're going to have a serious advantage. Your catchers come with NoS, so when they passblock, they can put a TZ on either end of the pass and still get the intercept attempt, 5+ with a reroll. This gives you a better than 50% chance (5 / 9 actually) of intercepting the ball. Not to mention putting TZs on your oppo, to force the ball to fall incomplete in the case of a failed interception. If you up your AG to 5 on these catchers, nobody will throw the ball unless they're really desperate or your passblockers are all on the ground.

It is one thing to say "ooh, use pass block", and another thing to actually use it effectively. In order to be effective, your passblockers need to be near the play but not so close that they get all tied down in TZs or blitzed out of the way. Therefore, you need to work on the skill of predicting where the play is going to go. Plenty of other people have talked about this skill as critical to good blood bowl defense in general. You need to put your players where the play will be next turn, not where it was last turn. Now, as a defender with good blitzers, you will likely find yourself in a position to funnel the play in a direction of your choosing. If you put equal strength everywhere on the defensive line, your opponent will probably get through somewhere, since he can focus his effort on just one part of the line. And if you're equally spread out, that breakthrough can happen anywhere. If you overload part of your defense, you can "encourage" your oppo to move to one sideline or the other.

Against a passing team, you should also do your best to put pressure on the passer or whomever has the ball. A passing team will usually send so many players downfield that they can't easily defend their own passer, and they depend on rapidly scoring to keep the ball from you. If you can outrun them, you can have the passer tied down before the passing play develops. Think of it this way: if they send two catchers downfield, each with a lineman for support, they've got 4 of their 11 players downfield. If you cover them with just two passblockers, now you've got a 2 man advantage trying to get to the passer. If you can buy just one turn with either lucky rolls or clever placement of your defenders, you can break up that play. This is a gamble, though, since if you fail to break up the pass end, the catcher will end up with the ball (unless you intercept it!) and might even be able to bleed a turn or two from the clock before you force a score or turnover.

Against a running team, you'll be outmuscled a lot. There's almost nothing you can do about that. But you still have some significant advantages: speed and agility. Use those skills to prevent the cage from forming if you can. Most running teams will keep some players back to receive the kick, maybe hand off to a runner, and form up a cage in the middle of the field. They can usually form a proto-cage the turn they receive (before your can respond), but it isn't really well formed until the second turn. On the first turn, they have players in the side zones (to protect against the blitz, if nothing else), they've got five or six guys on the line to hit your front three with assists (and secondary hits in case the first ones get pushes), and they've got guys in the way-back to recover the kick. If you have kick, you can make this even worse by kicking way deep.

So your first defensive turn is the best time to really break up the cage, but these guidelines could work in other situations as well. Use your speedier players to get behind the cage. Try to put guys on the back of the cage. Don't put guys on the front of the cage, instead put them one square away in front. The guys in the back, if blocked, will move the cage backwards or hold it still. The guys in front will need to be blitzed, and if there's too many there, you're good with that too. The big mistake to be made here is covering the whole cage in players. You don't want to give your oppo too many free hits, because you won't last long enough to survive it.

Once you have some guys with strip ball, and especially leap and strip ball, go for half-die blocks. You might not knock over the ballcarrier, but you can get the ball loose. Use leap to get to the center of the cage. If you don't have leap, blitz the front corner of the cage with your blitzer. Follow up and put a TZ on the ballcarrier. If the blitzer gets hit on the next turn, he's got Block and Sidestep, and maybe even dodge, he'll do fine. Plus which, the sidestep means he goes where you want, not where your oppo wants.

To sum up: get in the way at every opportunity. Put TZs on the ballcarrier and the ball. Force your oppo into weak situations, and don't be afraid to risk a half-die block or a 4+ pickup or dodge roll once in a while. Force blocks when it makes sense to, but don't get into a slugfest.

[pfooti]

or you could always save the apothecary for your first purchase and just pray game 1 goes well for ya and add the third re-roll

If you're playing in a league, go for the reroll first. A 'poth after the first game still only costs 50k, and a reroll goes up to 100k. A 'poth is only worth it if your first game is against a high powered killing team. Against another rookie team, you're probably not going to get a guy killed (but it does happen). But it will be a long time before you get 100k and decide "I'll get a reroll" instead of "I'll get a catcher".