Where would you go with this norse team?

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Fri May 15, 2009 2:07 pm

1 Berserker 6 3 3 7 Block, Frenzy, Jump Up - - - - - - - 90,000
2 Berserker 6 3 3 7 Block, Frenzy, Jump Up Piling On - - - 2 4 - 14 110,000
3 Ulfwerener 6 4 2 8 Frenzy Mighty Blow m - - 1 5 - 13 130,000
4 Ulfwerener 6 4 2 8 Frenzy - - - - - - 1 5 110,000
5 Runner 8 3 3 7 Block, Dauntless +MA, Dodge n - - 2 1 3 23 140,000
6
7 Thrower 6 3 3 7 Block, Pass Sure Hands, Accurate - - 5 4 - 1 22 110,000
8 Thrower 6 3 3 7 Block, Pass Leader - - 1 - 2 2 15 90,000
9 Lineman 6 3 3 7 Block - - - - - - - - 50,000
10 Lineman 6 3 3 7 Block - - - - - 1 - 2 50,000
11 Lineman 6 3 3 7 Block Dirty Player - - - 1 2 - 7 70,000
12 Lineman 6 3 3 7 Block - - - - 1 1 - 5 50,000
13
14 Lineman 6 3 3 7 Block Guard - - - - 3 - 6 80,000
15 Lineman 6 3 3 7 Block - - - - - - - - 50,000
16 Snow Troll 5 5 1 8 Loner, Claws, Disturbing Presence, Frenzy, Wild Animal - - - - - 1 - 2 140,000

+Apo & 4x RR & 6x FF & apoth. Team value at about 1640k now.

The league is a perpetual league with a regulated 1 challenge per round game system, with 4-6 games before play offs & final. Lost the final to an epic one turning wood elf catcher 2-1 (LRB5 wood elves). So now I can replan for another bunch of 4-6 games. There are no inducements in the finals & semis.

I feel the positionals in the new norse team are really bloated, compared to linemen who've got all that is needed & the price to boot. In the old system price didnt matter, so 4 berserkers was ok. Now I feel it's TV bloat to buy anything but 1-2 runners, 2 ulfs, 1 MB/PO zerker, 1 leader thrower & linemen.

I bought the troll cause the league had dwarf, 2x chaos dwarf, chaos & orc teams. Most of those are changing now though, so I wonder if I should sack the troll as well (imo he's too specialized/unreliable with no mb/regen/thick skull/tail/block & uber high price).

The runner skilled up last game (not updated in that list) & rolled double 4's. He's got niggling & MA8, so still go guard - or sure hands?

The plan now is to:

1) Get a block, dodge, sure hands runner as my primary ballcarrier and sack one of the throwers (the one who levels up last), giving the remaining thrower both leader AND sure hands.
2) Sack the troll... or make a blitzing troll (MB/jugs/guard)
3) Develop the berserkers/ulfs as killers (MB first skill all, piling on berserkers)
4) Sack 1-2 rerolls for a total of 2-3+leader
5) Develop the ulfs as Wrestle/Break Tackle/Tackle after the initial mighty blow (jugs/piling as alternatives)
6) Guard/tackle the berserkers
7) Fend 3 linemen, dp 2 linemen, kick 1 lineman, guard doubles

This'd leave me with:

2 Berzerkers: MB/PO (Tackle/guard)
2 Ulfs: MB/Wrestle/BT (Jugs/guard/piling/tackle)
1 Troll: MB/Jugs/Guard (or sacked!)
2 Runners: Dodge/Guard/MA & Sure Hands/Dodge
1 Thrower: Sure Hands/Leader (Accurate, Fend, Doubles: Dodge)
6 Linemen: Assortment of Fend, Tackle, DP and kick

Will be facing a lot of 1000k teams in the summercup, so expecting to face wizard & stars every game unless I tidy up my roster.

Comments/Suggestions?

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Fri May 15, 2009 7:37 pm

Replying to my own post

, but this is the 2 dev-trees I was considering:

"Traditional"
2 Ulfs: MB/Wrestle/BT
2 Berserks MB/Guard/SF & MB/PO
2 Runners: Dodge/Guard & Dodge/SH
2 Throwers: SH/Accurate & Leader/Fend
1 Troll: MB/Jugs/Guard
5 Liners: 3x Fend/ 1x DP/Tackle

4 RR's & apo
base cost: 1400k + skills

"Dirty Dozen"
2 Ulfs: MB/Wrestle/BT
1 'Zerk: MB/PO/Tackle
1 Throw: Surehands/Leader
1 Runner: Blodge, MA/Surehands
10 Linemen: 3 DP, rest Fend/Tackle linemanish skills

2 RR's & apo
base cost: 1140k + skills

Those are the two extremes I was looking at, the first one attempts to max out blodge/guard & takes advantage of all the positionals & easy access to P, A, S skills. The disadvantage = huge avrg. cost of players & yet not as reliable even with the added RRs + not optimally utilizing all the skills on the players (like pass, dauntless).

The other extreme is minimizing cost of the team & go berserk on fouling with a pinch of wrestle/break tackle ulfs, MA8 sure hands (later sure feet/SS) ball carrier, Leader-thrower backup ballcarrier & a Looong bench of superlinemen. All linemen go guard on doubles, rest fend/dp. The advantage: Players utilize their skills 100%, cost is pretty optimized. Disadvantage: Less S access, less guard, less blodge, no st5 big guy..

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:23 pm

I wonder why nobody ever replied to my thread. Sorry about this threadromancy, but the team has developed a bit now..

The runner picked up strip ball and a 2nd niggle, now he's at 8 3 3 7 block, dauntless, strip ball, dodge niggle/niggle/miss next game 160k. Should I sack him?

Berserker 90k
Berserker Mighty Blow/Piling On 130k
Ulfwerener Mighty Blow 130k
Ulfwerener 110k
Runner MA/Dodge/Strip Ball +niggle+niggle+mng 160k
Thrower Sure Hands/Accurate 110k
Thrower Leader 90k
3x Lineman no skills 150k
Lineman +Skill (norm) 70k
Lineman Dirty Player 70k
Lineman Guard 80k
Snow troll 140k

3 rerolls. 210k in treasury.. Any ideas for lineman skill, purchases? We're running a perpetual league, with no free inducement gold in semifinal + finals, otherwise normal LRB5+experimental rules.

I am considering kick, fend and strip ball (if strip ball, then sacking the runner). Not considering tackle, as that's going to be on the mb/piling on blitzer one day.

Have found plenty of use for all the positionals as well as the linemen with skills.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 2:47 pm

I'd keep the Runner whilst you skill up a replacement. Niggles mean he can die a good death on the pitch, no need to sack him.

I'd look at Tackle now. Never hurts to have more than one. Otherwise Kick is good. You can kick shallow and pressure agains the sidelines.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:06 pm

Norse aren't really "my thing"... so usually don't comment....

However, part of your bloat is from carrying more than 11 players.... Yes, you have that right, but at higher TVs... all your players will cost you.... Since you're meeting a lot of new teams (which you should shred anyway at your high TV/skill level), cull the roster to 11.... What's the worse that would happen: you get an mng/injury and have to take on a journeyman with BLOCK! There are much worse fates....

You'll rebuild quickly....

Sack "Fluffy" and the "Leader"... 3 rerolls are plenty....

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:12 pm

You can't run Norse with no bench. By the second half you'll be down to 6 half the time. AV7 remember.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:31 pm

Yep, I know Av7... and avoid it... but he's bloated and playing new teams....

The ultimate alternative: reset with a new team... problem solved....

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 5:12 pm

Needs more positioning skills.

If you get doubles on a second lino, take Grab. You won't be sorry.

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:51 pm

Nah, no way would I ever play 11 with norse. 13-14 minimum.

Took tackle on liner, it's obvious after all with 4 dodge heavy teams in the league. Still undecided on the runner (leaning on sacking), but I guess there's time as he's mng.

Norse is imo the optimal team for foul play. Effective cost of their linemen is 30k at 6337, as block is the "optimal" lineman skill. That's why you can run a long bench, and can run it cheap as well. If your DP is sent off, you replace with a "rookie" ma6 block liner..

If 3 rerolls is really plenty, then I should look at sacking a reroll, not the leader. Sacking the leader now & taking leader on the hero-thrower, that might be a good idea.

I don't really think Grab is that great a skill really. Imo guard&dodge are the only real options for a lineman double.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:36 pm

Carnis wrote:Nah, no way would I ever play 11 with norse. 13-14 minimum.

Took tackle on liner, it's obvious after all with 4 dodge heavy teams in the league. Still undecided on the runner (leaning on sacking), but I guess there's time as he's mng.

Norse is imo the optimal team for foul play. Effective cost of their linemen is 30k at 6337, as block is the "optimal" lineman skill. That's why you can run a long bench, and can run it cheap as well. If your DP is sent off, you replace with a "rookie" ma6 block liner..

If 3 rerolls is really plenty, then I should look at sacking a reroll, not the leader. Sacking the leader now & taking leader on the hero-thrower, that might be a good idea.

I don't really think Grab is that great a skill really. Imo guard&dodge are the only real options for a lineman double.

Assuming your opponents build under the same philosophy, an instance of Grab with all your Frenzy will give you a consistent 1TTD threat.

I'd give the Runner Side Step. With MA8 and Blodge, he'd be deadly at getting on the ball, and with even a rookie Berserker backing him up he'd push action away from him.

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Wed Jun 10, 2009 6:39 pm

So to summarize:

Keep double-niggled runner, until he dies on pitch.
Sack leader thrower. (-90k value)
Skill tackle on the lineman.
Hire new Runner (-90k treasury +90k value).

Anything else you'd do?

Mad Banker · Post by **Mad Banker** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 3:31 pm

mattgslater wrote:
Carnis wrote: I don't really think Grab is that great a skill really. Imo guard&dodge are the only real options for a lineman double.
Assuming your opponents build under the same philosophy, an instance of Grab with all your Frenzy will give you a consistent 1TTD threat.

Could you please expand on your reasoning here Matt?

I've been thinking about this one but I really don't see how 1 grab lino would ensure a consistent 1TTD threat...
At least not anymore than the consistent 1TTD threat you have anyway with the Norse and all their frenzy.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 4:36 am

Grab does the same as Frenzy on the line, but saves a block and is more controllable. It's also good in the wide zone, as it feeds Frenzies into the crowd.

Mad Banker · Post by **Mad Banker** » Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:20 am

mattgslater wrote:Grab does the same as Frenzy on the line, but saves a block and is more controllable. It's also good in the wide zone, as it feeds Frenzies into the crowd.

Been toying with this on play creator and indeed you're right...

It makes the Norse 1TTD way much easier.

I always thought guard was the only choice for linemen on doubles but now I'll definitely take 1 grabber!

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:50 pm

Mad Banker wrote:
mattgslater wrote:Grab does the same as Frenzy on the line, but saves a block and is more controllable. It's also good in the wide zone, as it feeds Frenzies into the crowd.
Been toying with this on play creator and indeed you're right...
It makes the Norse 1TTD way much easier.
I always thought guard was the only choice for linemen on doubles but now I'll definitely take 1 grabber!

Norse AV7 and no S access makes me pick guard every time. Grab for one unlikely 1TTD is just such a huge waste of a double imo. I play for the other 15 turns, anyway.