Pro Elf Qs

Master Wang · Post by **Master Wang** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 3:13 pm

This is the team * indicates normal skill up to decide. Unless otherwise indicated all players have their rookie stats and skills.

Blitzer*
Blitzer*
Catcher Wrestle
Catcher*
Thrower
Lineman*
Lineman
Lineman
Lineman
Lineman
2Rerolls
1Apothecary
FF2 (IIRC)
100K

So far they are very young: won 2; lost 1.
I'm 99% decided on Dodge for both Blitzers, Wrestle for the Catcher and of course Kick for the lineman.

But the other 1% whispers Tackle and Frenzy for the Blitzers, and Strip Ball or Leap on the Catcher. One concern is that if I give dodge to two players, I'm going to need to give to everyone to make it hard for teams with only one or two Tacklers to mark them.

My other thoughts are about the 100K, Reroll or Catcher? I think Reroll as I really regret not getting a third from the get go.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 3:23 pm

Dodge x3, Kick. You already have a Wrestle Catcher. If you can't deal with a single Tackler, I got no advice. Skill your linos: that's the only advice I can offer.

JaM · Post by **JaM** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 4:52 pm

I agree on dodge for the blitzers. Block might work on the catcher, using him in a blitzing role. Of course, next skill could be dodge then.

reroll seems good to me. 3 RRs makes this team complete 9rr-zise), after that get catchers.

GL !

JaM

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Thu Aug 06, 2009 5:51 pm

My pro-elves don't take Dodge.
Too many teams will have too much Tackle too quickly.

Enables you to take other skills which are harder to negate.

So for me, Diving Tackle on both Blitzers, Wrestle/Block on the Catcher and a Kick lino.

Master Wang · Post by **Master Wang** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 3:09 am

PubBowler,

I'll probably stick with Dodge as I am completely new to playing Pro-Elves (and not that experienced in general at the game), but I can see where you're coming from with the no Dodge philosophy, and as the Botocs leeg is perpetual, the amount of Tackle will just go up.

After Diving Tackle, what would you take next? Jump Up for mobility? Shadowing to shut down the player you're marking even more? Tackle to combine with DT? Fend to give a little bit more protection to the player?

I'll probably play another couple of games with the team over the weekend so I still have a little time before deciding.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 3:41 am

If you take Diving Tackle over Dodge, follow with Jump Up.

But try to skill linos. Of course the first one gets Kick, but Dodge or Side Step (or Wrestle if Dwarfs are coming up) can keep your line of scrimmage from suffering undue injuries. If you're up against a lot of chain-blockers, Side Step is a good way to prevent injury and lock the opponent out, and will also take pressure off your Blitzers.

Ullis · Post by **Ullis** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 6:11 am

I'd take Dodge on both blitzers. To be honest, especially at this stage you won't face too many Tacklers yet unless you face a dwarf team in which case the proposed Diving Tackle is pretty useless too. I myself get much better with Pro Elves after the faster players get Dodge.

Block or Wrestle on the catcher (I think only one is too little) and Kick on the lineman.

I also fully agree with Matt's suggestion of skilling up the linos. If you have three Block or Wrestle linemen for los duty, it will do wonders for your attrition rate over a match. It either ties up the los blockers by not getting knock downs or taking them down with you which is great for Elven defence where the first offensive turn and your subsequent defensive turn can be crucial.

Smeborg · Post by **Smeborg** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 8:29 am

I would recommend the following, based on experience:

- Dodge on the Blitzers. There is no better first normal skill for them.

- Dodge on the Catcher. You need to re-inforce his ability as a scorer first, as well as preparing his ability as a blitzer. Second normal skill (not first) is Wrestle, followed by Tackle.

- Kick on the Lino. Like Woodies or Skaven, thjis is a team that loves Kick - it should be an automatic first normal skill choice on a Lino (Guard is the automatic doubles choice).

Bear in mind that the Catchers are the real blitzers of the team, due to their superior MA and their ability to catch the bouncing ball. The Blitzers are really defensive blockers, and need to be developed as such (e.g. Fend as the second normal skill, Guard on doubles, etc.).

I don't agree with the idea of not taking Dodge for this team, although of course I am open-minded until I get thrashed by such a team in practice... In my view, even the most Tackly team has 5 or 6 players without Tackle - often these players without Tackle are the fast playmakers that you need to be able to beat with Dodge.

You are right, the team is very short of Re-rolls. I suggest you need to buy a 3rd Re-roll ASAP and take Leader on the Thrower as first skill-up. Then you can play in a gung-ho style and counter-attack aggressively for the first 4 turns or more of each half. This is how Pro-Elves love to play, i.e. win first, die later.

Hope this helps.

Hope this helps.

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Fri Aug 07, 2009 5:01 pm

Master Wang wrote: After Diving Tackle, what would you take next? Jump Up for mobility? Shadowing to shut down the player you're marking even more? Tackle to combine with DT? Fend to give a little bit more protection to the player?

Guard on a double.

For normal, depends on your league.

If you're marking the backs of cages more: Shadowing
If you're marking deep catchers etc more: Tackle

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 3:26 am

I wouldn't follow Diving Tackle with Shadowing. Tackle or Jump Up, if you're opposed to Dodge and in favor of Diving Tackle. If you must avoid Dodge, good alternatives to Diving Tackle are Tackle, Fend or Frenzy for a first skill, depending on what you face. Diving Tackle is a good follow-up to Tackle.

Unless you expect ≥25% of your matches to be against Dwarfs, Chaos Dwarfs or teams with heavy Tackle investment, I'd strongly recommend Dodge. Tackle players are often Blitzers, just the kinds of guys you want throwing the blitz against your AV8/Block players. Taking lots of Dodge also seriously reduces the impact of big guys.

Ignore doubles on this player. He has what he needs in the G and A categories. Guard is good for other guys, but this guy's job is to play on an island: he only really gets to use Guard on offense, where frankly it's extraneous (viable, but not the best skill available). On D, he's often laying the smack from the weakside, hoping to put a TZ on the ball. If he's not, he's either getting marked by a nasty or soaking up a blitz. Playing on an island, he'll always give up 2d, and he'll give up 3d if he gets hit by ST5. Dodge is critical for that, Guard is of limited value. Major Caveat: If you've got a well-developed team with several guys who can play corner, you can move a Guard Blitzer to an inside LB position (moving a safety up, turning the PE "dime" into a lopsided nickel) and then his skill set is perfect. In that case, get him Dodge ASAP, and then Fend.

My progression is:

#1: Strongside (I don't know which one this is until interior players develop)
Dodge, (Fend or Jump Up), (Dauntless, Fend, Jump Up, Leap or Tackle). 10 gets +MA if I don't have a clear #2, +AV or skill otherwise, 11 gets +AG and moves position, 12 gets +ST. Ignore doubles on first two rolls, consider Mighty Blow, Guard or Grab thereafter.

#2: Weakside
Dodge, Frenzy, (Diving Tackle, Leap or Tackle). 10 gets +MA, 11 gets +AG, 12 gets +ST. Ignore doubles on first two rolls, consider Mighty Blow or Juggernaut thereafter.

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:51 am

mattgslater wrote:Ignore doubles on first two rolls, consider Mighty Blow or Juggernaut thereafter.

Never skip a guard in an elven team. Even more crucial for the blitzers. An "Ultimate" elf blitzer has (block), dodge, guard, sidestep (and tackle/mighty blow).

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:47 am

That's where we'll have to disagree. I think one should never put Guard on the point-man, and that Guard is an automatic doubles selection, but only for linos.

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 1:47 pm

Pro Elves more than other teams don't Blitz with their Blitzers.
That's what their Catchers are there for.

These guys have Block & Side Step, both synergy with Guard very well.

Catchers might get other other double choices.
But not Blitzers.

I don't favour Frenzy on the Blitzers as they are often playing in and around a cage the forced 2nd block is not always helpful.

I would take Frenzy on at least one Catcher.

Master Wang · Post by **Master Wang** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 2:09 pm

Thanks for the imput everyone.

I'm going to take Dodge on all three (Kick was selected for the lino straight away). The main reason for my decision is my experience with Elves was, until recently, limited to one-off matches so I want to keep my skill choices fairly basc for now. As the league is open and perpetual, I'll be facing all kinds of opposition and will have the chance to rebuild without Dodge if I so wish in the future, or simply start another team.

Thanks again,

Wang

Cam Jessup · Post by **Cam Jessup** » Sat Aug 08, 2009 2:20 pm

Sorry to jump in after the bull may have jumped the gate but I am finding playing a pro elf team with 2 RR to start and no dodge to date quite satisfying. As I put only lineman on the line of scrimmage and use my postitionals soley for blitzes and dodging I find that AG 4 is more than adequate to cover my dodging needs. I personally have found block to be more useful than dodge for pro elf positionals (read catchers and throwers) as generally I am dodging on a 2 or 3 and block forces my opponent to burn rerolls, particularly on catchers as having a player with MA: 8 in their half of the field gives them fits, dodge while useful seems to play a second to block or even dauntless/frenzy on catchers. I have to admit to enjoying it more than any grown man should on blitzers!

Personally with your skill ups I would look at Dodge for your blitzers and dauntless, frenzy or jump up on your catcher. Kick of course for the lineman!