Buying an assassin for a couple of games against av7?

[dines]

Hi im in the middle of a league with a pretty developed dark elf team (1990), 13 players: 4 blitzers, 2 witches, 1 runner, 6 linemen. Looking forward to meet the following teams:

chaos pact, skavens, underworld and woodies in no particular order.

I have 240k in stash so thought about buying an assassin just for the fun of it. My team has the highest tr by far, so can't hope to induce him in any games.

I haven't played with an assassin, but as i'm going to meet 3 av7 teams, I thougt it could be good fun. What do you think? Is he worth it? I probably wouldn't blitz with him, rather tie up downed players and use him on/behind the LOS (offence/defence). Might also try to use him as a catcher by putting him in scoring position in offence, if he's marked, might as well stab instead.

After these games, there is a single game before playoffs, that most likely is against a high av team, so might just fire him after these games.

[Aliboon]

Might as well get him, if only for the free stab on the LOS. You might wanna do a bit of homework on your opo's TV though as if getting him means that they can afford to get a wizard/other tasty inducement, then he might not be worth it.

[mattgslater]

Have fun with your Assassin, that's what I say! Those guys are far from great, but they're massively underrated.

[dines]

Might as well get him, if only for the free stab on the LOS. You might wanna do a bit of homework on your opo's TV though as if getting him means that they can afford to get a wizard/other tasty inducement, then he might not be worth it.

Well thats not really possible the way our league is setup atm, so either I get him and hope for the best, or get the less inducements against me. The woodies and underworld are probably around 1300-1400 and skavens at 1600-1700 depending on their next games. Therefore the teams are probably going to get all the crazy inducements they can wish for anyways. Think ill take him. Anybody with good ideas or tactics for good use?

[Porkus_Maximus]

I would only bother with him if your opponent has a lot of blodge/wrodge IE woodelves. Unless the skaven has put a lot of effort into developing his linerats, most of them probably wont even have any skills so you'll be able to bash them up just fine without the assassin. Not really got any experience vs underworld but just looking at rosters and skill selection etc. it seems to be that dark elves should have no problem vs them, so just do whatever you want.

[Smeborg]

I have a better suggestion: hire 2 Assassins. In my experience, 2 are more than twice as good as 1 against the AV7 teams (Woodies, Skaven, Underworld in your case). 1 is taken out relatively easily. 2 will mess with the opponent's head.

[Asperon Thorn]

Might as well get him, if only for the free stab on the LOS. You might wanna do a bit of homework on your opo's TV though as if getting him means that they can afford to get a wizard/other tasty inducement, then he might not be worth it.

Well thats not really possible the way our league is setup atm, so either I get him and hope for the best, or get the less inducements against me. The woodies and underworld are probably around 1300-1400 and skavens at 1600-1700 depending on their next games. Therefore the teams are probably going to get all the crazy inducements they can wish for anyways. Think ill take him. Anybody with good ideas or tactics for good use?

Score with him so you can get him block relatively quickly . . useful to keep him on his feet. Then you can place him next to guys and you can stab them without using your blitz. You should also get sidestep relatively quickly as well.

I always think that tackle matches up with shadowing players. . .so for long term try and fit that into your build, then he is good for more than just stabbing. Multiple block on doubles, of course.

Against AV7 just try and use your knife often. Once you start getting the numerical advantage you can back off and start SP farming. . .Also, against all those AV7 teams I ussually slow my Dark Elves way down, not stalling mind you, but definately a plodding pace.

Asperon Thorn

[mattgslater]

Dodge over Block, especially on a team with a lot of Dodge to thin out the opposing Tackle, and especially especially on a player who never blocks.

[Asperon Thorn]

I like to round em out. . .so they are useful outside of just av7. Hence the block . .When up against a dwarf I am going to make him hit.

I mean, so far we are planning on how to use this guy against those av7 teams but what are the other teams that he is going to have to face?

If those av7 teams are it. . then dodge would definately be before block.

Asperon Thorn

[mattgslater]

I mean, so far we are planning on how to use this guy against those av7 teams but what are the other teams that he is going to have to face?

Looking forward to ... chaos pact, skavens, underworld and woodies in no particular order... After these games, there is a single game before playoffs, that most likely is against a high av team, so might just fire him after these games.

To answer Asperon's broader question, vs. a high-AV team, his role is either to mark the few low-AV or Blodge guys (Hobs, Gobs, -AV guys, Ghouls, the various Renegades, Orc Throwers) or to trade the dagger for a clipboard and hang out with the coaching staff, or play deep backup safety. If I knew I were up against Dwarfs a lot, then maybe I might consider Leap over Dodge.

If you have a Dodge Assassin, you can put him up on AV8 or Break Tackle big guys; Stab functions as an ersatz Dauntless, and as scary as Break Tackle/ST5 sounds, its Achilles Heel is Shadowing, because BT only works once and MA6 Shadowing is pretty effective on a big guy's MA. AV7 isn't happy against those types, but they rarely have Block, so most big guys are only 11/36 or at best 91/216 to knock you down.

I might take Dodge, because if I'm going to commit 20k and -1AV to making a splashy purchase of Stab and Shadowing, I'm going to protect it a bit, you know? In that case I most certainly would follow with either Pass Block or Side Step, as this player is an anti-Agility specialist. Beyond that, he's merely a third-string free safety. Besides, Dodge is the poor man's Leap anyway. I've never taken two Assassins, so I can't speak from experience, but if I did, I'd put Leap on #2 as a first skill.

[Greyhound]

jump up over block or dodge

Jump up is a free stab with no risk and can be done every single turn he's down (and adjacent). It increases his use massively.
Yes he may die, but with this as this first skill you'll get more mileage from him for the next few games.

[Grumbledook]

I would go Dodge, Side Step then Jump Up

if you have block rather than dodge you get knocked over and pushed back, if you have dodge they just push you back but when they use block to knock you over, then you are standing next to them next turn to use jump up for a 2+ stab attempt

of course you could argue that block would be better than jump up and it probably is as you have side step, diving tackle would also be great

not that my assassin ever got any SPP ;]

[Smeborg]

I would go Dodge, Side Step then Jump Up

if you have block rather than dodge you get knocked over and pushed back, if you have dodge they just push you back but when they use block to knock you over, then you are standing next to them next turn to use jump up for a 2+ stab attempt

of course you could argue that block would be better than jump up and it probably is as you have side step, diving tackle would also be great

not that my assassin ever got any SPP ;]

I agree with Grum on both counts, (a) the best order of skills, probably, and (b) that Assassins never skill up. I think in a whole season my pair of Assassins got 6 SPPs between them (an MVP and a PC - the one with the MVP was crippled and retired). This wasn't for lack or trying... For this reason, I don't take them now, except as Mercs. But dines' case is special - 3 out of 4 remaining opponents "demand" Assassins on the park.

Rashnak is an awesome Star with Stab, Dodge, Sidestep. With these skills you can mark the right type of opposing player (practically any AV7 or AV8 player without Block). Sidestep gets you a lot of stabs.

Assassins don't skill up for several reasons: (i) they are always stabbing, this precludes earning SPPs, (ii) they are lousy ball carriers, so can't score TDs (if you want to get turned over, give the ball to an Assassin), and (iii) if they are in a receiving position, they will tend to get targetted by opponents before you can get the ball to them (this is not necessarily the best tactic for the opponents, but it's what they do).

All the best.

[Alamar]

Have fun with your Assassin, that's what I say! Those guys are far from great, but they're massively underrated.

Against the right team [IMHO] the Assn. can be great. The best Elf coach that I know [by leaps & bounds!!!] uses them to great effect. I had a Khemri team that managed to build up enough skills to start dominating every team in the league with the exception of the DEs. A lot of his strategy would be to leap & stab the ball carrier on the Blitz. If a TG happenned to get the ball then Dauntless & Block would pretty much always take care of a TG eventually.

Basically who cares about Guard, Blodging Ball carriers, etc. when leap & stab goes straight to an AV roll. Even if he fails then he repeats with the other [usually protected] Assn until one of the stabs work, the ball bounces out of my cage, then he picks it up and scores

The only time I ever got close is when I put 10 players in the CAS box "relatively early" but was down 3-0 by the time it matterred. The other 4 players didn't suffer worse than a KO so by the time I scored it didn't matter because he could field enough guys so I didn't get the "cheap" victory.

Edit: Said Elf coach was very careful in planning his positioning so that he could spread around points for COMP && TD. While the ASSN was never a ball carrier he could just dodge away, get to the endzone, then the ball carrier would move & handoff or pass and basically skilled up this way. He also skilled his linemen and every other position "just right".

In essence he was on another level entirely and no coach in the league could hold his jock strap [with Elves] ... He was mortal though with "bashy" teams.

[dines]

Thx a lot for all the replies. I will definately buy one assassin and see how it goes. I am hesitant to buy two for several reasons: I only have one figure and need the players latest mid next week and we have a house rule requiring players to be painted in order to make casualties and tds. Furthermore would it empty my cash reserve and with 30k spiralling expenses, it would be difficult to replace injured players.

I need some special tricks against the skaven so an assassin might be the thing. He has a gutter w. ag5, leap, blodge and pass block and another with wrestle, strip ball. It's going to be an interesting game