Mixed race teams: an old new way of doing it

[Thadrin]

Each team may consist of members of up to four races. The races and proportions thereof depend on what sort of team you choose:

Old World:
Primary race = Humans
Secondary race = Dwarfs
Tertiary race = Halflings
Big Guy = Ogre or Treeman

Chaos Warband:
Primary Race = Norse
Secondary Race = Chaos
Tertiary Race = Skaven
Big Guy = Ogre or Minotaur

Creepers:
Primary Race = Skaven
Secondary Race = Goblins
Tertiary Race = Goblins
Big Guy = Troll

(plus any other fun or fluff supported ideas)

The team may consist of:
0-8 linemen of the Primary race
0-4 Linemen of the Secondary race
0-2 Linemen of the Tertiary race
0-1 Big Guy

The team may additionally include up to two Positional players (non- linemen, where a lineman is considered to be the cheapest player on the roster). Both may be from the Primary race, or a maximum of one of these may be from the secondary race. No Tertiary race position players are permitted. Note that the Positional players are IN ADDITION to the Lineman slots.

Reroll costs vary roster to roster (the prices will need some testing.)

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Flame away.

[Ghost of Pariah]

OI! Read my article in House Rulez magazine. I already suggested this. The BBRC didn't like it of course.

[Mojoshenpo]

... I really didn't like the ally rules in any set....

That having been said, perhaps each league should have a post-season, dungeonbowl game based on those school of magic combinations. Or run two concurrent leagues....

Eh, what the hey! Just because I don't like uber-combo player teams doesn't mean anyone shouldn't do it....

[Thadrin]

Sorry Eric - don't remember the article. Musta read it, but don't remember it. Came up with this one on my own, but I imagine the inspiration came the same place so I'm not surprised I'm not the first to come up with some variation on the theme. At least we're thinking on the same lines. Maybe once the BBRC see that the rules as they stand are considered totally broken then they'll consider alternatives again.

Mojo - I don't want uberteams. I want teams that include members of various races, almost exclusively linemen, for a bit of flavour. I've written anice bit of fluff for a mixed Dwarf-Human-Halfling team. Give me Linemen and Longbeards and I'm a hppay camper. A team with a grand total of two position players and extortionately priced rerolls should be balanceable. THESE ARE NOT ALLY RULES. THESE ARE MIXED TEAM RULES. Important difference.

[Ghost of Pariah]

Hey no problem, Thads, I just ripped it off from Dungeon Bowl anyway. lol

[Icedman]

It'd probably work better than the current teams (that said, I don't necessarily mind the current mixed race teams, but I haven't seen them used ) coz heck, it works for DB.

How would you do an Undead team (as the DZ team is gonna die soon ), maybe...
Primary Race: Necromantic
Secondary Race: Khemri
Tertiary Race: Khemri
Big Guy: Mummy or Vampire Lord

Maybe throw the Vamp team in as Secondary or Tertiary, but would anyone take Skelies/Thralls?

[Thadrin]

It occurred to me that if the Khemri team were to be given a big guy then they have these Construct things in the WFB army.

Anyway, remrmber the two positional player rule. That would mean a team like the one you propose being almost entirely made up of Skeletons and Zombies, with maybe a Wight and a Mummy.

[Zombie]

It has the advantage of being not being overpowered like the current rules. Allied teams should be worse at playing the game, not better. That's what the fluff says and that's what game balance says as well.

I don't like ally rules in any shape or form, but if i had to pick one (and the option "no allies" wasn't there for me), i'd pick this one.

Oh, but i'd change the numbers to 0-8, 0-6, 0-4, 0-1. This way, there would be more diversity among teams, and more choices for the coach. The way your numbers are now, on a complete team, you have 7-8, 3-4, 1-2, 0-1.

[Thadrin]

I wanted to do 0-6 on the secondary race with 0-10 on the primary.
Problem there is, people seem to think a team of human Linemen getting 6 Longbeards to protect the one catcher and one thrower they'd have is broken.
The rules I set out allow for 0-10, 0-5, 0-2, 0-1 with the position players accounted for. Its in the choice of which position players you take that the real choices come.

The actual numbers and framework would need testing, but it gets mixed race teams - specifically my old world Brewery team and and "Underworld Creepers" style teams - into the realms of possibility while not making them overpowered (the only reason my Old WOrld team ISN'T over powered is that I don't ever want elves on the roster because they don't fit the fluff).

And lets not forget I'm advocating keeping the extortionately priced rerolls from the BBMag3 rules.

And I'm still very much on the no allies bandwagon. I don't want allies on normal rosters in any way shape or form ever again.

(can't believe this...two posts in quick succession where I agree with Zombie...been a strange day...)

[Zombie]

Yeah, but notwithstanding which two positional players you take, you have max 15 players plus these two. For a 16-player team, this only leaves choice for which single player to leave out. What i'm saying is that every team will have 7 or 8 linemen from race 1, 3 or 4 from race 2 and 1 or 2 from race 3. Not much diversity and they'll all look exactly the same except maybe for the positional players. I'd like more diversity as to how many linemen from each race you can take.

If you're just worried that 6 longbeards is too much (despite the fact that chaos dwarves get just as many and have 2 bull centaurs and a big guy), then you could just make dwarves the tertiary race and bring that number down to 4 again.

[Mestari]

Im leaning towards the opinion that perhaps we shouldn't search for a single receipt of a mixed race team. Each team should be assessed separately in order to ensure that it's balanced.

So for example:
Good Guys:
Humans, Dwarves or Elves and halflings, Ogre

0-12 human linemen
0-2 human players
0-2 Dwarf/Elf linemen
0-1 Dwarf/Elf players
0-4 halflings
0-1 Ogre
Rerolls=80k

Underworld Creepers:
0-10 Goblins
0-4 Linerats
0-2 Skaven players
0-1 Troll
0-1 Rat Ogre
Rerolls= 90k

I'd have to think the Chaos team a bit, but you get the point.

[Thadrin]

Not enough of a mix for my liking there...too much "humans and friends" and way too many elves

I don't really want any elf allies of any sort. They develop into useful catchers too easily. A dwarf Blocker develops viciously, but still not as dangerously game changing as a really skilled up Elf can.

I could live with 0-10, 0-6, 0-4, 0-1 on my original idea. I don't think there's a balance problem with the extra Longbeards/Beastmen. If we went that route though I'd suggest positionplayers count against their race's numbers (so you couldn't take 6 Longbeards and a Dwarf Blitzer.)