More than one player able to intercept

DanielLaw · Post by **DanielLaw** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:03 pm

A coach in our league asked me why only one player was allowed to intercept. Why not have every eligible player able to make an attempt? Speed? Game balance? Interested to hear your thoughts.

tenwit · Post by **tenwit** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:22 pm

Yes. Yes.

Best two reasons to ignore fluff: speed and balance.

It's a free chance to catch a ball with none of the normal risk of turnover, and moreover, if successful it causes a turnover for your opponent! It's the only action that every player can do out of turn (pass block, tentacles and shadowing require skills), so lots of restrictions should be placed on it.

DDogwood · Post by **DDogwood** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:12 pm

Passing over opponents is risky enough as it is - without a skill like Safe Pass, there's a 17% chance that you will lose control of the ball and suffer a turnover. If two opposing players were allowed to try, the chance would be almost 30%, and if three opposing players could attempt an interception, the chance of a turnover would be over 40%.

Passing is risky enough as it is.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 5:36 am

And if you allowed every opposing player to attempt to intercept, why not any player on your own team?

stormmaster1 · Post by **stormmaster1** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 4:07 pm

Darkson wrote:And if you allowed every opposing player to attempt to intercept, why not any player on your own team?

because that would be stupid. your linemen/blockers should know that the pass is aimed for the catcher in the EZ.

David Bergkvist · Post by **David Bergkvist** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:08 am

I really don't see any balance problem of allowing every opposing player under the ruler to attempt to intercept. It's not like interceptions are too common.

Daefaroth · Post by **Daefaroth** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:47 am

oooh, I got it

a) roll for the pass, check for accurate/fumble
a1) resolve fumbles
a2) resolve for inacurate, scatter throw x3
b) line up the throw using the pass ruler
c) resolve for pass block
d) starting at the 1st square on the ruler, roll intercept attempts
d1) due to the arch of the throw, only players in the first 4 squares or last 4 squares of the throw can attempt intercept.
d2) safe throw reduces this by two squares, long legs or big hand increase this by 2 for that player
e) if a character makes the intercept attempt, they should then immediately make a catch roll to see if they can hold onto the ball
...

and yes, I was attempting to make this as complicated as I could in a short time; I don't honestly think this is a good idea

David Bergkvist wrote:I really don't see any balance problem of allowing every opposing player under the ruler to attempt to intercept. It's not like interceptions are too common.

Since a 6 always succeeds, if you have 3 players under the ruler (not an unlikely scenario) you have built up a minimum 50% chance of an interception. IMO that is way too high.

David Bergkvist · Post by **David Bergkvist** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 11:23 am

Since a 6 always succeeds, if you have 3 players under the ruler (not an unlikely scenario) you have built up a minimum 50% chance of an interception. IMO that is way too high.

In order to have 3 players under the ruler, the pass needs to be at least a short pass and probably longer, and thus the thrower is probably proficient at passing, which means that he had the chance to take safe throw. If he chose to make the pass even though there are three opposing players who can intercept and he doesn't have safe throw, he deserves to have them succeed.

Btw, one AG 4 player with catch also has more than 50% chance of intercepting. I would say it's more of a problem if one player can intercept at more than 50% chance, that that three players, together, can.

Daefaroth · Post by **Daefaroth** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 11:46 am

David Bergkvist wrote:Btw, one AG 4 player with catch also has more than 50% chance of intercepting. I would say it's more of a problem if one player can intercept at more than 50% chance, that that three players, together, can.

I'm inclined to disagree with this, I think that one high agility player with a skill in catching the ball should have a better chance of catching the ball than 3 random chumps (assuming that 3 random chumps were allowed to attempt the interception, which I don't think is the best method)

David Bergkvist · Post by **David Bergkvist** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 12:18 pm

Even the "three random chumps" are professional blood bowl players. Also, the question was about balance, not fluff.

Daefaroth · Post by **Daefaroth** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 12:35 pm

I apologize if my post sounded 'fluffy'. I didn't mean it to be.

To clarify, I believe that one AG 4 player with catch should honestly have a better chance of getting their hands on the ball than three AG 3 players without catch.

I would expect a player that has a 35 in 36 chance of catching an accurate pass in no tackle zones to be good at catching the ball.

Hopefully that is suficiently fluffless.

sann0638 · Post by **sann0638** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:24 pm

3 random chumps actually have just over 42% chance of an interception:

1/6+(5/6*1/6)+(5/6*5/6*1/6)

Worth knowing!

David Bergkvist · Post by **David Bergkvist** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 2:45 pm

Daefaroth wrote:I apologize if my post sounded 'fluffy'. I didn't mean it to be.

To clarify, I believe that one AG 4 player with catch should honestly have a better chance of getting their hands on the ball than three AG 3 players without catch.

I would expect a player that has a 35 in 36 chance of catching an accurate pass in no tackle zones to be good at catching the ball.

Hopefully that is suficiently fluffless.

I fail to see why it is important for balance that a player that is better than three guys at catching the ball should also be better than three guys at intercepting the ball. If anything, it should be the other way around: if A (be it one player or several players) is better than B at one thing, then B should be better than A at another thing.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 8:53 pm

I agree with Daefaroth - those that specilise in catching should have a better chance to intercept than 3 random players (assuming none of the 3 are also specilised cathcers

).

Daefaroth · Post by **Daefaroth** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 4:53 am

David Bergkvist wrote:I fail to see why it is important for balance that a player that is better than three guys at catching the ball should also be better than three guys at intercepting the ball. If anything, it should be the other way around: if A (be it one player or several players) is better than B at one thing, then B should be better than A at another thing.

Okay balance arguement:

increasing the number of interceptions allowed will increase the relative power of the skill safe throw, which in turn increases the power of the High Elf Thrower relative to other throwers. If you feel that the High Elf Thrower is currently balanced (maybe he isn't, I don't have stats) than the adjustment to interceptions would change game balance in regards to throwing teams.