passing over the big guys

grimfang · Post by **grimfang** » Wed Dec 18, 2002 11:07 am

Was just thinking... which is not easy sometimes... and a thought occured to me.
When a player tries to throw the ball over the head of a big guy, shouldn't their be some additional penalty to the pass.. considering the size of the player, it would require a higher throw, as well as block the line of sight to the target.
Also.. i am just thinking that perhaps the big guy would have a better chance of intercepting it than a normal player (YES.. I KNOW... they have crappy agility.) Or maybe they could have a Swat Ball skill, which knocks it out of the air and causes a scatter.
Input would be appreciated.

Asmodan · Post by **Asmodan** » Wed Dec 18, 2002 11:24 am

I also find it a bit strange that its as easy to throw over a goblin as an ogre.
It should not be easier to intercept for Big Guys as they are very clumsy, but maybe instead you could say that on a roll of 5 the ball is not thrown high enough and it hits the Big Guy and scatter three times from him?

Asmodan

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Wed Dec 18, 2002 11:29 am

I always thought that the pass was lofted up in a arch so would go over most players, and intercept meant that it was more of a direct throw and it got stopped.

Marcus · Post by **Marcus** » Wed Dec 18, 2002 11:44 am

If you wanted to house rule this I'd do one of the following:

1: Big Guys get +1 on intercept rolls - just like players with Very Long Legs

2: -1 on the pass roll for every square occupied by a Big Guy (from either team) the pass ruler passes over

Have fun.

slackman · Post by **slackman** » Wed Dec 18, 2002 7:43 pm

yeah, you're right, it doesnt really make much sense. but then, the more i think about most game mechanics, the less sense they all make. before you decide to change the rules, you really must contemplate how it will affect the game. sure, it makes more sense that a big guy could knock the ball off target, but what else will happen if you change that? if you put a -1 mod on the pass, thats 1/6 higher chance of every single pass attempt of being a fumble! even if you put in an ugly addition that it only affects accuracy, and not a fumble, the only teams you are going to penalize are the ones who cant take big guys of their own. btw, as it stands now, a player w/ ag3 not in any tzs must roll a 6 to succeed. why should your ag1 troll have double the chance to pick it off just because he's taller? he certainly isnt going to be jumping like the other player would, and if you watch football, very rarely are passes thrown low to the ground. and the only cases that occurs are very short range passes where no opponents are in the way. on the matter of things making sense, it certainly doesnt make any for the following situation

T . . . . . . X . . . . C

if T is throwing to C, the rules state that X can intercept. but i assure you that in order to get the ball from T to C, its going to be an arc way over the head of X, even if he is a big guy.

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Wed Dec 18, 2002 10:13 pm

If you do it properly there IS a penalty. You see when use the range ruler you are supposed to put the little circle on the thrower's head and the redline on the receiver's head. If a big guy is in the way the ruler will arc upwards and make the range ruler read a longer pass than if it were straight. I big guy in the way can make a quick pass into a short pass very easily.

longfang · Post by **longfang** » Wed Dec 18, 2002 11:33 pm

Nice, but then you'll have to have a rule of " thr rule must pass 1 inch above an ogres head and then it gets silly with people reaching for rulers, and so on. But if your both just really cool about the whole thing then just do what ever is simplest.

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Thu Dec 19, 2002 12:22 am

It should also be harder to leap over a big guy then. Blood Bowl is not supposed to be such an accurate depiction of reality. Leave things as they are.

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Thu Dec 19, 2002 1:13 am

Let's have lofted passes that the Ogre can't reach, let's have 40K line of sight sticks so you can put some heat on it and zing it past the brute's midriff so fast he can't react (course we'd have to reduce the max range)..let's er...not bother?

Been facetious, sorry, but I'm not keen.

LOL at Pariah! I've got visions of a Morg in a throwers face and the range ruler arcing upwards at like..60 degrees..
" I spit on your Nerves of Steel!".

You lunatic!

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Thu Dec 19, 2002 6:02 am

That's how we did it. The little circle had to actually touch the passer's head and the red line had to actually touch the receiver's head. If a big guy is in the way then you have to bend the ruler around them. It increases the pass distance and is the proper way to do it. The rulebook doesn't say anything about removing players from the pitch before you measure.
It really only makes a big difference for the short and quick passes. Long passes and bombs don't get affects as much.

Before y'all laugh take some minis out, set it up and look for yourself. If you want to give big guys a way to block pases it works.

sean newboy · Post by **sean newboy** » Thu Dec 19, 2002 10:27 am

Of course if u have a steady hand, and half an ounce of intelligence and realize that its just a game and doesnt have to be scientifically accurate u could hold the ruler high enuf that it doesnt touch any mini's and its the same distance it would be anyways. This is to rules lawyer Mr. Pariah esquire who prolly if he was playing woodelves and had treemen would deliberately model them with both hands up so he could make a 4 square pass into a long bomb.

There was a poll on this board that asked if the game was the proper length, most people wanted it a lil shorter, I really dont think bothering to bend the ruler on passes is going to help, and would not be fair to every team, especially when u consider that citadel changes the average height of mini's every time they redo a team.

Redfang · Post by **Redfang** » Thu Dec 19, 2002 10:43 am

sean newboy wrote:This is to rules lawyer Mr. Pariah esquire who prolly if he was playing woodelves and had treemen would deliberately model them with both hands up so he could make a 4 square pass into a long bomb

Or you could model a troll on stilts!

franck_le_grand · Post by **franck_le_grand** » Thu Dec 19, 2002 9:32 pm

marcus wrote:If you wanted to house rule this I'd do one of the following:

1: Big Guys get +1 on intercept rolls - just like players with Very Long Legs

2: -1 on the pass roll for every square occupied by a Big Guy (from either team) the pass ruler passes over

Have fun.

I think the BG is to dumb to catch the ball and I don't think it should get any easier.

And BTW lets keep the game simple. That's why we don't play 2nd ed. still. The 2nd ed. was just too complex. Everytime you made a fart you had to roll on 32 different kind of tables!
The 3rd ed. changed that and lets keep it that way.

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Fri Dec 20, 2002 1:36 am

Damn sean, you're a bit uptight aren't ya?

grimfang · Post by **grimfang** » Fri Dec 20, 2002 8:36 pm

hmm... touchy subject i guess.
I would not advocate ever making it easier for a BG to catch or intercept a ball. However, it does not take any intellegnece or skill to simply set hit in the head by a pass... Randy Moss is a perfect example! They hit him, then hit the ground and bouce. On rare occassions, one wil stay in his hands. And he is a big guy... well.. he's tall. I guess the difference is that he is usually the intended target. Oh well... it was a good theory.