Permanent Starplayers

[Toby]

Based on http://blood-bowl.net/BBMagArticles/OutRetire.html and http://www.specialist-games.com/bloodbo ... layers.pdf

Removed all Big Guy including Thrud (Barbarian) and Hthark (Bull Centaur), and Secret Weapon Stars. I feel these characters are covered by their respective rules (with regard to future SW rules), this is about permanent Starplayers.

The Rules:
Stars cannot use Team Rerolls, they are to selfish and arrogant.
When creating a League Team a Star costs double, during the campaign normal.
Tournaments Teams can only freeboot Stars.
A Star has already collected points, is not peaked and can collect more. (A Veteran, for example already has 16 points).
Stars count against position Limits, human blockers take up the big guy slot.

I haven't done this thourougly so some typos might be in there, but its to give some idea on more variety on team lists.
Champion = Emerging Star
Category: G(eneral),F(physical),W(secretweapon), and so on.
Cost: the formula is simple: single 10K, double or stats up 20k.
And i dont know what JJ has about chaos...

[Chaos]
Chaos Warrior Rookie 5|4|3|9 100.000 GSF
Chaos Warrior Veteran 5|4|3|9 Dirty Player, Foul Appearance 130.000 GSF
Chaos Warrior Veteran 5|4|3|9 Dauntless, Frenzy 140.000 GSF
Chaos Warrior Champion 5|4|3|9 Pass, Sure Hands, Tentacles 150.000 GSF
Chaos Warrior Star 5|4|3|9 Dirty Player, Mighty Blow, Block, Leader 150.000 GSF
Chaos Beastman Rookie 6|3|3|8 Horns 60.000 GSFW
Chaos Beastman Veteran 6|3|3|8 Horns, Dirty Player, Extra Arms 90.000 GSFW
Chaos Beastman Veteran 6|3|3|8 Horns, Claw, Very Long Legs 100.000 GSFW
Chaos Beastman Champion 6|3|3|8 Horns, Prehensile Tail, Tentacles, Two Heads 120.000 GSFW
Chaos Beastman Champion 7|3|3|8 Horns, Frenzy, Razor Sharp Claws 120.000 GSFW

[DarkElf]
Dark Elf Blitzer Rookie 7|3|4|8 Block 100.000 GA
Dark Elf Blitzer Superstar 7|4|4|8 Block, Dirty Player, Dodge, Pro, Tackle 160.000 GA

[Undead (Regeneration)]
Undead Mummy Rookie 3|5|1|9 Mighty Blow 100.000 GS
Undead Mummy Champion 4|5|1|9 Mighty Blow, Break Tackle, Stand Firm 150.000 GS
Undead Skeleton Rookie 5|3|2|7 30.000 GW
Undead Skeleton Champion 6|3|2|7 Block, Pro 70.000 GW
Undead Vampire Rookie 6|4|4|8 Bloodthirst, Hypnotic Gaze 140.000 GSA
Undead Vampire Veteran 6|4|4|8 Bloodthirst, Hypnotic Gaze, Block, Dodge 160.000 GSA

[Orc & Goblin]
Black Orc Blocker Rookie 4|4|2|9 80.000 GS
Black Orc Blocker Champion 4|4|2|9 Block, Mighty Blow, Stand Firm 120.000 GS
Orc Blitzer Rookie 6339 Block 80.000 GS
Orc Blitzer Starplayer 6339 Block, Mighty Blow, Pro, Stand Firm, Leader 140.000 GS
Goblin Runner Rookie 6|2|3|7 Dodge, Right Stuff, Stunty 40.000 AW
Goblin Runner Veteran 6|3|3|7 Dodge, Right Stuff, Stunty, Dirty Player 80.000 AW

[Human]
Human Blocker Rookie 4|4|2|8 Mighty Blow 90.000 GS
Human Blocker Veteran 4|5|2|8 Mighty Blow, Block 120.000 GS
Human Catcher Rookie 8|2|3|7 Catch, Dodge, 70.000 GA
Human Catcher Champion 8|3|3|7 Catch, Dodge, Diving Catch, Sure Hands 110.000 GA
Human Catcher Champion 8|3|4|7 Catch, Dodge, Leap 120.000 GA
Human Catcher Superstar 8|2|4|7 Catch, Dodge, Block, Leap, Sprint, Sure Feet 130.000 GA

[Wood Elf]
Wood Elf Line Elf Rookie 7|3|4|7 70.000 GA
Wood Elf Line Elf Veteran 7|3|4|7 Block, Pass Block 90.000 GA
Wood Elf Wardancer Rookie 8|3|4|7 Block, Dodge, Leap 120.000 GA
Wood Elf Wardancer Veteran 8|3|4|7 Block, Dodge, Leap, Catch, Sprint 140.000 GA
Wood Elf Wardancer Champion 8|3|5|7 Block, Dodge, Leap, Diving Catch, Side Step 160.000 GA

[Halfling]
Halfling Runner Rookie 5|2|3|6 Dodge, Right Stuff, Stunty 30.000 AG
Halfling Runner 6|2|4|6 Dodge, Right Stuff, Stunty, Block, Nerves of Steel 100.000 AG

[Skaven]
Skaven Linerat Rookie 7|3|3|7 50.000 GFW
Skaven Linerat Star 7|3|3|7 Block, Dodge, Guard, Leap 110.000 GFW
Skaven Linerat Champion 8|3|3|7 Catch, Extra Arms 110.000 GFW
Skaven Gutter Runner Rookie 9|2|4|7 Dodge 80.000 GAF
Skaven Gutter Runner Star 9|3|4|7 Dodge, Extra Arms, Prehensile Tail, Two Heads 160.000 GAF
Skaven Thrower Rookie 7|3|3|7 Sure Hands, Throw 70.000 GPF
Skaven Thrower Veteran 7|3|3|7 Sure Hands, Throw, Accurate, Strong Arm 100.000 GPF

[Dwarf (Thick Skull)]
Dwarf Troll Slayer Rookie 5|3|2|8 Block, Dauntless, Frenzy 90.000 GS
Dwarf Troll Slayer Champion 5|4|3|8 Block, Dauntless, Frenzy, Mighty Blow 140.000 GS

[High Elf]
High Elf Dragon Warrior Rookie 7348 Block 100.000 GA
High Elf Dragon Warrior Veteran 7448 Block, Dauntless 140.000 GA

[Lizardmenf]
Saurus Temple Guard Rookie 6419 80.000 GS
Saurus Temple Guard Superstar 7429 Block, Guard, Stand Firm 160.000 GS

[Dragoonkin]

I'd never buy a rookie player if I could buy these ones. Start my Chaos Warrior off with Dauntless and Frenzy for only 40k? Yes please. Heck...with DP, Mighty Blow, Block and Leader for 50k? I'd buy three.

[Toby]

3 Leaders and you can only use one?

150K and 300K when creating.

So you say you start yout chaos Team with 11 Beastmen and save up the money (600K) to buy 4 Stars?

Stars with skills that you partially might not even want and that cannot use team rerolls? And each adds 10 Points of Teamrating from his 51 SPP.


Despite that, I just sticked close to the original.
The skaven thrower for example is broken in my oppinion, he must have an additional "crap skill" that costs 20k like Spikes.

[Dragoonkin]

I'd rather build my own players, to be honest.

[Toby]

Exactly. But now if your "own built star" dies, and you have 150K to burn?

Other Stars add more variety. I would like to see a High Elf team with 2 ST4 Dragon Warriors or the Daek Elves with 4 ST 4 Blitzers at max. If they ever manage to afford them...

[Thadrin]

Despite that, I just sticked close to the original.
The skaven thrower for example is broken in my oppinion, he must have an additional "crap skill" that costs 20k like Spikes.

Is there anything in this game that ISN'T broken in your opinion Toby?
This idea is just a nasty little powergamer thing for people too lazy to build up their teams the way normal players do "I can't be arsed actually developing a player, doing the hard work of getting all those SPPs. I'll just buy a ready made star."

[Dragoonkin]

If my "own built star" dies and I have 150k to spare...then why would I take a built-in inferior version with no reroll access who takes up gobs of TR? It's a vicious circle that just ends up with you having a team of these "prebuilt" overpriced players that can't use rerolls. Someone dies? Pick up a cheapie replacement to save some time...except that he causes more problems than not because of the lack of RR usage.

I'd rather just put the games into training a replacement. And that way they turn out how you want, cost you less points of TR, cost you less money...and who knows? Maybe you'll get a cool surprise and roll some +AG for that Chaos Warrior or who knows what else. I'm proud of my +MA +AG Chaos Warriors...they're damn unique. And if I was buying off-the-shelf players I'd never have anything like 'em.

Toby, this is just basically an addendum to your idea of making replacement players cost less. Instead of making them cost less, this idea is just to make them cost more...but come already "packaged" with the skills you'd want. It's obviously intented for a high-cash, high-player-turnover environment where there just isn't the TIME (in player life expectancy, that is) to build up cool players.

It defeats the purpose of player turnover, by making it not something you really suffer for, because if someone dies you just slap in a new cookie-cutter replacement player...and when he dies, you do the same thing again. And again. And again. Until you don't even make your own players anymore, just use Star Players.

I'd rather have players who Aged early but I built up from struggling nobodies into their current form, than cookie-cutters bought off-the-shelf. It's like cooking...mom's homemade cookies are always better than store ones.

[Toby]

Thadrin, You are an ignorant fool.

If you had any brain than you would see that self build players are always superior and there are only limited scenarios where these Stars could give you an real advantage.

However, they give you a shortcut to some skills you might wann atry out without spending 7 years hoping for a double 6.

And the skaven thrower is broken IN MY OWN SUGGESTION, superman.
Its broken because it fits what you are saying.

[Thadrin]

Thadrin, You are an ignorant fool.

True. I'm an ignorant fool who knows a hell of a lot about Blood Bowl though, which is more than we can say for you.

If you had any brain than you would see that self build players are always superior and there are only limited scenarios where these Stars could give you an real advantage.

So why bother with them? its pointless rules bloat.

However, they give you a shortcut to some skills you might wann atry out without spending 7 years hoping for a double 6.

Ah. Is poor little Toby not getting enough strength upgrades. Diddums.
You're a powergamer in denial Toby. Bloodbowl doesn't need any more strength players. Doubles rolls are plentiful enough for people to take the rarer skills if they want to (Mutations specifically).

And the skaven thrower is broken IN MY OWN SUGGESTION, superman.
Its broken because it fits what you are saying.

It fits what I'm saying? I'm saying the Skaven thrower isn't broken at all!

Do us all a favour and go back to whatever online powergamer haven spawned you.

[Toby]

Dragoonkin, you are to short sighted on this.

Permanent Starplayers should give you skills faster, but without (complete) controll. So a "self built" player will almost certainly fit your strategy more perfectly.

However it opens up some interesting splits. My favorite is the human blocker that is an alternative for the Ogre (i would pick the rookie), and the High Elf Dragon Warriors at ST4 Dauntless.

In case of the High Elf Team, this would make this team more interesting, and provide a Shortcut to luck (6+6) but Dauntless isn't exactly what I would pick if I already had ST+1,so theres a downside to this as well.

I can imagine a scenario where i would buy a AG4 Human Star Catcher, because the one I build with AG4 had to be retired and the league is already advanced and I require a capable scorer.

If you would just let it get into your heads that permanent stars are not to replace self build ones or make them inferior; verry much the opposite.

[Toby]

It fits what I'm saying? I'm saying the Skaven thrower isn't broken at all!

the star player thrower from JJ's out of retirement with Accurate, Sure Hands, Strong Arm and not a single SPP "wasted" in a imperfect skill.

u just plain suck man.

[Thadrin]

Those are house rules from a pre-LRB article you moron. Inadmissable.

[Darkson]

Thadrin, You are an ignorant fool.

If Thadrin is an ignorant fool, I wonder what that makes you?


I don't want ready made Sp, I want to make up my own, tell a story with them as they develop, be able to laugh when my lineman fails that quick pass for the 5th game in a row to get his frst skill.

Toby, you've been told on numerous posts that you idea's are at best mistaken, at worst the ravings of a powergamer. Why can't you just accept that the majority of people don't like the majority of your suggestions, people (unlike myself) who have been playing for years non-stop?

[Toby]

Those are house rules from a pre-LRB article you moron. Inadmissable.

maybe you shoul have read one line of my posting before wasting your time discussing somethin you simply DO NOT LIKE.

And my suggestion does not impose yu to use it, but why do i bother to explain?

[Thadrin]

be able to laugh when my lineman fails that quick pass for the 5th game in a row to get his frst skill.

have you been reading reports of my games?