Rookie Skaven....3 Doubles! Update 13/10

Skarsnikk · Post by **Skarsnikk** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:39 pm

I played the first league game with my Skaven the other night and came away with a 4-1 win and 5-4 on casualties!
As a result all three Gutter Runners skilled up as did a Stormvermin, the first Gutter runner received block with a normal skill roll, but the other players all rolled a double!

My thoughts are Extra Arms, Very Long Legs for the Gutter Runners and either Horns or Claws for the Stormvermin.

Any other suggestions?

Rest of my team comprises of 6 linemen, 1 Thrower and 1 more Stormvermin. Three of the Linemen are on 2 spp's each.
The league has Slaan, High Elves, Chaos Pact, Dwarves, Chaos Dwarves 3 x Orc teams.

Baduk · Post by **Baduk** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:15 pm

a claw on that blitzer seems like a good idea to me (but I'm practicly a noob so maybe you shouldn't listen to me) hehe

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:18 pm

Hmm...

Good doubles for GRs are Two Heads, Horns and Big Hand. Or go VLL and plan for Leap (however this leaves Block until 31 SPP).

I like Horns on a Blitzer. Claw is great if you already have MB, but on its own it isn't actually that effective. I took Dodge on mine but regreted it, so I would ignore that option.

irlandes · Post by **irlandes** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 1:25 pm

claw to the blitzer!
big hand to a runner is very nice for ball recovery (and eventually you will have a wrestle-dauntless-strip ball to loosen the ball), so it is Hail Mary Pass: it gives you the chance to make a HMP with him or make a run-pass-run-handoff play for a TD, which makes the oposite team very uncomfortable.

Carnis · Post by **Carnis** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 2:27 pm

Horns the blitzer, ignore the double on the GRs and take block, or take twoheads..

Horns on a GR is imo pretty lame, as dauntless is simply better (works vs s4 too), and doesnt cost you 30k. I would not be ready to invest on both horns AND dauntless for the S4 players..

Did you roll any double5's or double6's? Both those stats are better for the GRs.

rodders · Post by **rodders** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 4:53 pm

you may not think it but guard on a gr is great

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:04 pm

Carnis wrote:Horns on a GR is imo pretty lame, as dauntless is simply better (works vs s4 too), and doesnt cost you 30k. I would not be ready to invest on both horns AND dauntless for the S4 players.

It's true, I would take 2Heads or Big Hand over Horns.

rodders wrote:you may not think it but guard on a gr is great

It's true. Cos he can get anywhere.

bjorn9486 · Post by **bjorn9486** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:19 pm

With that many bash teams, I would take claws personally, but I've never played Skaven so it looks good on paper to me only.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:30 pm

Joemanji wrote:
rodders wrote:you may not think it but guard on a gr is great
It's true. Cos he can get anywhere.

Yeah, but he can get anywhere, like into a spot where he can assist without Guard. I see how it would be useful, though.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:37 pm

mattgslater wrote:Yeah, but he can get anywhere, like into a spot where he can assist without Guard.

There are plenty of times where no such square exists. Or where the Guarder can both cancel an opposing assist and add his own offensive assist.

Wanchor · Post by **Wanchor** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 5:55 pm

Horns for the Blitzer without a doubt. Big Hand for one of the Gutter Runners...whatever you want for the other.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Wed Sep 23, 2009 6:16 pm

Joemanji wrote:
mattgslater wrote:Yeah, but he can get anywhere, like into a spot where he can assist without Guard.
There are plenty of times where no such square exists. Or where the Guarder can both cancel an opposing assist and add his own offensive assist.

Good point. I ripped open a nasty Saurus cage yesterday off two blocks engineered by a Guard Wight. Also, a GR on the offensive LOS lets you spread your weapons out deep, drawing off would-be rushers. Alternately, if the ball gets a bad lie and you can't retrieve it out of blitzing range, you can drop this guy directly in front of the ball-carrier. Particularly right now, when there aren't a lot of skills going around and nobody has MA5+/Tackle.

Blitzer: Horns is the best Stormvermin Mutation on the whole, but this league wants you to give him Claw. Either way is fine, and in either case, follow with MB and either SF, PO or Pro, and use him to hunt Blitzers. While he may not live long, people will fear him.
GR (Normal): Block or Wrestle. Follow with Dauntless.
GR (Double): Got four propositions: pick any two.
* Extra Arms, follow with Block.
* Big Hand, follow with Leap.
* Either VLL or Nerves, as antecedent to a combo with Leap/Catch/Pass Block.
* Guard, and follow with Block, then Side Step.

Sir Not-Appropriate-for-This-League, but really cool in some leagues, is a GR with Prehensile Tail. Follow with Shadowing or Tackle, and put him one square off of a Wardancer.

Ullis · Post by **Ullis** » Thu Sep 24, 2009 10:54 am

I'd take the following:

1. Claw on the Blitzer. This is due to the league composition. There are lots of AV9 teams and all the other teams are AV8. Moreover, both Orc and Dwarf teams can start struggling quickly if you can remove players from the pitch. Follow with MB and Piling On.

2. Guard on a GR. First of all, a skaven team does need Guard and getting it on linemen isn't guaranteed. Especially as the first Blitzer is designated for a killer role due to taking Claw so he won't be gettin Guard. Secondly, a very mobile Guard can be really good on defence. Follow with Block and Side step (as matt suggested).

3. Big Hand on a GR. For the reasons given above, it's just good on defence.

This all means that you should take Wrestle on the first GR who got a normal skill if you can still change it. He'll be getting Dauntless and Strip Ball next.

irlandes · Post by **irlandes** » Thu Sep 24, 2009 11:21 am

Guard on a Gutter is very useful, but puts a bulls-eye on his forehead. Once you have block it is a no brainer (I did it myself with a sidestep blodger and it is cream...) but without block and in a bashy leage he is going to last a match or two.

There are lots of people here who think Horns is a no-brainer for a stormvermin... why? I've played a lot with skavens and my blitzers are never safeties or ballsackers... why put horns on them? (I'm asking because I don't really see their utility and would love an explanation...)

stormmaster1 · Post by **stormmaster1** » Thu Sep 24, 2009 3:31 pm

i'd go for claw on the blitzer. reducing player numbers makes skaven more effective, just more space for your gutter runners to use. mighty blow is better on its own, but no guarantee you can get another double. vs bashers a claw+MB blitzer will really shine (until he dies).

for the gutter runners take whichever skills you will use most on defence. gutter runners don't need offensive skills usually.