ORC Blitzer, Guard or Strip Ball?

Gus · Post by **Gus** » Sun May 02, 2004 4:21 pm

NightDragon wrote:I am not a great believer on guard for Orc blitzers, not staright away anyway. Linmen can have block/guard. Orc blitzers you should make more aggressive. Tackle definately than guard.

i don't get you. you actually recommend to take Tackle on the Blitzers who have ST access, and Guard on Linorcs who only have General access ?

Mad Banker · Post by **Mad Banker** » Sun May 02, 2004 5:14 pm

Gus wrote:
NightDragon wrote:I am not a great believer on guard for Orc blitzers, not staright away anyway. Linmen can have block/guard. Orc blitzers you should make more aggressive. Tackle definately than guard.
i don't get you. you actually recommend to take Tackle on the Blitzers who have ST access, and Guard on Linorcs who only have General access ?

on a double I suppose...

Gus · Post by **Gus** » Sun May 02, 2004 6:03 pm

Mad Banker wrote:on a double I suppose...

sure, but you can't tell someone to get skills on doubles as a "general" progression. esp when it's mentionning 2 skills. i wish my lineorcs rolled doubles by their second skill, but it's not the case

NightDragon · Post by **NightDragon** » Sun May 02, 2004 7:32 pm

Yeah, but in my experience you get enough doubles to get plenty of guard. Blitzers should have the hurting skills. Give the BO blockers guard as well.

sangraal · Post by **sangraal** » Sun May 02, 2004 11:27 pm

squig87 wrote:
Gus wrote:LoL ok, i mentionned i would take guard on non-doubles or 6+4, i forgot to add agility upgrades... i'll edit my post.

to make matters clear: the only characters i wouldn't take agility upgrades on are BOBs and the BG.
You wouldnt take ag on BOB? ...why? having a potential ST4 passing, catching, dodging, ball carrying threat is awesome.

An orc team in my league got +ag BOB and he developed really quick.

Squig

I agree with Squig87 ---- I was lucky enough to roll +1AG for 2 BoBs in the same game --- one already had Stand Firm, the other Block.

Apart from being able to handle the ball just as well as the rest of your
team --- giving you options you never had before ---- it also helps in the
big games where the other guy has a wizard --- people like to fireball
the orc cage --- the BoBs are usually targets --- not so effective with AG3.

I really do think it will get the BoBs to 31Spps quicker, especially if the
alternative skill is Guard --- 'cause Guard isnt going to help you get SPPs
for the BoB is it?

sangraal

NightDragon · Post by **NightDragon** » Mon May 03, 2004 8:56 am

No my preference is to give hurting skills throughout and then fall back on guard. I am merely stating that guard on a blitzer IME and IMO is wasted. Yes its much better to give them a non st skill like tackle! As for BO's the first skill I ever give them is block and the next usually MB, but if they regularly come up against BG's in the front line then guard is an option.

TuernRedvenom · Post by **TuernRedvenom** » Mon May 03, 2004 10:28 am

NightDragon wrote:No my preference is to give hurting skills throughout and then fall back on guard. I am merely stating that guard on a blitzer IME and IMO is wasted.

I think this goes for most bashy teams. Never put guard on your blitzers, you should give them skills like tackle and strip ball to go after ball carriers and fast annoying dodgy stuff.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Mon May 03, 2004 1:55 pm

Guard. I took Strip Ball as the first skill for one of my human blitzers. 17 games later, and I have not used it even once. Guard on the other hand is always very useful.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » Mon May 03, 2004 2:07 pm

TuernRedvenom wrote:you should give them skills like tackle and strip ball to go after ball carriers and fast annoying dodgy stuff.

seriously, giving a general skill (tackle) to the only few players of the team that have strenght access, seems like the biggest mistake ever to me.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Mon May 03, 2004 3:12 pm

Let me play devil's advocate for a moment. The argument for giving Tackle to an Orc Blitzer would be thus:

An Orc lineman generally does not progress that quickly. The chances of having multiple linemen with two or more skills is unlikely in most teams. And obviously, any lineman's first skill will be Block (or Guard on a doubles roll). At high levels of TR though, the Orc team really needs a few guys with Tackle. Just about every other team will have at least a ball carrier with blodge, if not five or six guys. The higher MV of the blitzer (and the fact that they have Block to start) means that they will usually end up performing the blitz actions. This is why Tackle is more useful on them than on a lineman. Of course, blitzers also tend to earn SPPs at a faster rate too, and so have more skills.

IMO, the three main skills for your blitzers are Tackle, Guard and Mighty Blow. A mixture of the three accross the team probably works best.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » Mon May 03, 2004 5:14 pm

my opinion is that if you really need to get the balle free and cannot succeed, give STRIP BALL to one blitzer, and guard to the others. and at high TR, when there are so many blodgers, your linemen should have block and tackle, or your blitzers should be beyond their first skill (guard in my book) so you could make them get tackle if you believe you need it.

of course, in a league with onyl elves and amazons, go for tackle. i'm only talking for a general case there.

NightDragon · Post by **NightDragon** » Mon May 03, 2004 7:12 pm

I would probably give only 1 orc blitzer guard to help other blitzers out. I also agree with Naz that StripBall is a much overated skill. Blitzers, especially Orc ones, should either flatten someone senseless or weaken this potential with the option of reducing the chances of escaping them. With this in mind MB and Tackle would be my first choices in that order.

Vero · Post by **Vero** » Mon May 03, 2004 7:37 pm

I was thinking how you should generally develop blitzers. Because tackle and stip ball are doing same thing (getting ball out of blockders) probably two different pairs would do well. Assuming roughly same development speed and no doubles.

Code: Select all

#           1st skill, 2nd skill, 3rd skill,  4th skill
1st Blitzer Guard      Tackle     Mighty Blow Pass block
2nd Blitzer Guard      Strip Ball Mighty Blow Pass block
3rd Blitzer Tackle     Guard      Pass block  Mighty Blow
4th Blitzer Strip Ball Guard      Pass block  Mighty Blow

On doubles stand firm and dodge are good choices for both types and skills like catch for strip ballers (because tackle is better at defending the thrower). For same reason +ag and +ma guys should take strip ball route.

Two guarders early on help to get enough power and tackle & strip ball helps getting catchers down and ball bouncing. With 2 skills each that's about the best blitzer quad in game with 16spps on each. Later Pass block & mighty blow helps against passing teams and will incease casualty rates and make some fear for opposing team.

It's just a though, doubles will come some day and mix the plans. Of course, in same situations a lot of tackle is needed and some leagues need four guards early on etc.

NightDragon · Post by **NightDragon** » Tue May 04, 2004 8:27 am

True, it does depend on the League your in.

harald · Post by **harald** » Tue May 04, 2004 9:00 am

Start w/ two blitzers w/ tackle. It will help to get pesky blodgers on the ground early on. You need two since one is easy to take out of the game plus that you can't use dodge skill when fleeing from them.

Guard as the first skill on the other two.

You should get mighty blow on both the tacklers. Many catchers have an AV of 7 which will result in an X% (Ian help me out here) increase in catcherfatalities or knocks which is very nice when playing defense against them.

Get strip ball as the 2nd skill on one of the Guards.

Then go with your inner waaagh to select the rest of the skills.