Wrestle vs Block for Zombies

[Smeborg]

swil -your style of play with Wrestle Zs sounds good, and I suggest you stick with it. It's always difficult for the opponent when the little guys on a team become the threats. Most teams (not all) work better with some Wrestle players. Maybe the Zs are suitable candidates on the Necro team? Anyway, I think there is quite a wide scope for different development plans on this team.

On both the Undead and Necro teams, I like to give the Wights some early TDs, ideally getting them to 16 SPPs reasonably early in the league.

All the best.

[MKL]

Well, my experience is that the zombies hang around in the middle of the pitch, but if you use the FGs (SF) and WWs (Frenzy) right, that is exactly where your opponent will be (...)

Different playstyles bring different experiences
As a general rule, I use the F-Golems to control the middle of the pitch and force the opponent toward the sidelines. Zombie are on the sides, to create the impression of a weak point. If I lure the opponent on the sidelines, Frenzy Wwolves and S-Stepping Ghouls can swoop down on 'em.

Note that I'm not saying "u'r wrong, I'm right": just comparing different tactics. Like I wrote, you made a good argument for Wrestle Zombies, and "aggressive Zeds" is a temptation to me too

[swilhelm73]

Oh, I've no question that there are many play style options...and of course however you *want* to play this is also partially determined by your opponent's strategy and team.

Necros play very differently vs say a highly developed Chaos or WE team.

I usually keep the FGs in the edge of the middle zone. In a classic ziggaraut I do something like;

http://www.play-creator.com/viewplay.asp?viewplay=9872

Attacking the wings is going to be tough without a lot of SF - and generally when my opponent tries that they get bogged down.

If they go up the middle though progress is slow - the fast players on the wings can attack any openings in the cage/screen, the zombies with wrestle are likely to open holes in the cage screen, and if all else fails the golems are convenient for pinning players for wolf assassinations.

[neverworking]

given your ridiculous league record Swilhelm I can't help but think your plan works too well for you to question it. Reflecting on your experience one thing that came to mind is that the Necro team plays considerably faster than an undead team and is more capable of scoring from farther out, taking more risks and recovering more easily on defense. Consequently the loss of movement caused by wrestle may be less significant on a Necro team than it would be on an undead team. In any event you win far too much with that team to even debate your plan is less than optimal for your play style and roster.

[Smeborg]

given your ridiculous league record Swilhelm I can't help but think your plan works too well for you to question it. Reflecting on your experience one thing that came to mind is that the Necro team plays considerably faster than an undead team and is more capable of scoring from farther out, taking more risks and recovering more easily on defense. Consequently the loss of movement caused by wrestle may be less significant on a Necro team than it would be on an undead team. In any event you win far too much with that team to even debate your plan is less than optimal for your play style and roster.

neverworking - another consideration is that it's easier to give Wrestle to 2 or 3 Ghouls on the Undead team, given that they have 4 of them (1 or 2 can be developed as ball carriers).

[Smeborg]

swil - what is your development plan for Zs after Wrestle? What do you give them on doubles? Do you have any multi-skilled hyper-active Zs yet?

[swilhelm73]

swil - what is your development plan for Zs after Wrestle? What do you give them on doubles? Do you have any multi-skilled hyper-active Zs yet?

They tend to die before getting too many skills. They score no TDs, throw comparatively few blocks, are used for marking and line fodder.

The path for a line zombie I think would be;

Wrestle, Fend, Dodge on Doubles.

I'd also like a DP zombie...but ideally this would be his only skill.

Also, the kicker spot has driven my nuts. If you look at my defense from above, the players I have in the kicker position are the FGs and WWs. The former skill too slowly to take kick - my build path is Block, Guard, MB, so kick would at best be 4th, and Break Tackle seems hard to turn down in that spot. And no way am I putting kick on the WWs - there are too many other great skills.

So, I tried giving a wrestle zombie kick at one point, and bench a ghoul on defense. It worked ok...until the zombie got killed.

[Smeborg]

swil - there are other teams that struggle to fill the Kicker position. With such teams I often do without a Kicker.

[MKL]

Swilehelm, you got interesting ideas about the Zombies... but what about the F-Golems?
I'm asking 'cause the F-Golem is a pet topic of mine.
Their role in defense is fairly clear (uber-roadblock, to put it bluntly), but what about the offensive drive?

[swilhelm73]

Swilehelm, you got interesting ideas about the Zombies... but what about the F-Golems?
I'm asking 'cause the F-Golem is a pet topic of mine.
Their role in defense is fairly clear (uber-roadblock, to put it bluntly), but what about the offensive drive?

I've gone with a standard build for mine - block, guard. Though one of the two got +ST which is nice. Of course to balance it out the other took 30 games to get his first skill.

I mostly use them to plug lanes on both offense and defense. The +ST FG can mark two players at once VERY well. And enemy cages generally move away from him. He also makes a good full back to open up the defense. I generally let him get stuck in traffic since SF/Guard/AV9 is a nice setup in a scrum.

I line them up right behind the front line to stop most teams from following up, and to keep the center maintained - even if you take out the whole front Z line, you are probably not going to be able to get free unless you take out one of the FGs too.

[neverworking]

If you have the Cyanide game and Blood Bowl Manager, you can download Swilhelm's replays too. The best leagues to look for that will have his matches are:

GOBBLN Premier Season 3 Final (a set of playoff matches)
GOBBLN Premier Season 2 Final (a set of playoff matches)
GOBBLN Broken Jaw (set of regular season matches)

[swilhelm73]

If you have the Cyanide game and Blood Bowl Manager, you can download Swilhelm's replays too. The best leagues to look for that will have his matches are:

GOBBLN Premier Season 3 Final (a set of playoff matches)
GOBBLN Premier Season 2 Final (a set of playoff matches)
GOBBLN Broken Jaw (set of regular season matches)

And the team is metabolically Challenged.

[MKL]

If you have the Cyanide game and Blood Bowl Manager, you can download Swilhelm's replays too. (...)

No Cyanide here
No more videogames since 2006, for that matter

[Piousman]

I am a fan of Wrestle Zombies myself, but I always give Kick to one as the first skill. As far as deployment, I use only 1 Ghoul on defense, and replace him with my Kick Zombie.

As such I try and build my Ghouls according to their job:
* 1 offensive with Block & Sure Hands
* 1 defensive with Wrestle and Strip Ball

in the GOBBLN league I have found that Kick to be invaluable, allowing me to kick shallow and capitalize on Blitz! results or early fumbles.

- Piousman
aka Punkistador

[MKL]

@Piousman
Since you chimed in, Punkistador, I make you the same question:

(...) you got interesting ideas about the Zombies... but what about the F-Golems?
I'm asking 'cause the F-Golem is a pet topic of mine.
Their role in defense is fairly clear (uber-roadblock, to put it bluntly), but what about the offensive drive?