How many models do I need/ what models can I use/permissable

[TedStriker]

Hello,

Complete Newb here, so if this topic is in the wrong forum please move it.

I have a few newb questions. I read the sticky posts above dealing with the TR 100 and 110 teams and this is an excellent starting point for us Newbs. The first question I had was how many models do I need? I understand as the league progresses I will be adding players to my roster. Is there a general guideline or advice for a mature team (we already have a starting point in the above stickies)? Maybe some specifics on my situation. Being completely new (only have 3 full games under my belt), I have Orcs and Humans. I have picked up a few extra plastic guys on eBay. I know I can only have 4 BOB and 4 Blitzers from their team card. But in reality, when I have a full 16 team roster, will I need 4 BOB and 4 Blitzers? Or is money better spent someplace else. See where I'm headed? So as I watch eBay for extra players, if I had some idea of where I was ending with my team, I would know I would only have to buy say 3 Blitzers and 4 BOB. I know there are many different strategies and different team builds etc. I also know I will learn alot as I play. But if someone could give some general advice for orcs and humans such as "many good orc and human teams usually end up with 4 blitzers" or "it is silly to have more than 2 catchers". This would also help with my painting as being completely new to miniatures (3 painted total so far), I am very slow. So if I had a good idea what I needed, I could spend more time playing and less painting figures I'll probably never use (although I'm enjoying the painting aspect of the hobby very much).

While I'm typing a long winded post, might as well throw in another question. I won a skaven team on ebay. When I opened it, it had 4 stormenvermin and only 4 lineman. On GW website, it said the team boxes should have 2 SV and 6 Lineman. Is it permissable (when playing at a LGS or tournament) to use stormenvermin as lineman? Do the models matter that much? I have seen people talk about conversions. Are figures you make yourself, or modify, acceptable? Or in general, does this create too much confusion on the pitch and I should just try to trade/buy some more linerats?

I'm not there yet, but I guess any advice for a mature skaven team (same reasons as first paragraph) would be appretiated.

[Cloggy]

In general, it's best in the long run to try to get the maximum number of non-lineman players a racial roster allows. In the case of Orcs, at higher Teamrating you field one lineman (your dirty player) or none at all. 4 BoB, 4 Blitzers, a Troll, 1or 2 throwerss, and 0 or 1 lineman is the most used line-up for developed orc teams.

As far as mini's are concerned, I would want all of the above, 4 lineman mini's, and 2 goblin mini's to cover all possible stages for a developing team.

For the skaven question: in casual league play it can be accepted to play with'the wrong mini's, but for larger tournaments I would recommend getting the team complete. I am kinda puzzled about how you ended up with 4 stormvermin on the same team, since as far as I can recall there has not been more than 2 SV allowed on a skaven team (more experienced guys: feel free to correct me, and tell beautiful stries about 1st and 2nd edition and such). I prefer to play against teams where I can easily tell the different players apart. Being an online player mostly I have enough trouble keeping my game together on that confusing board as it is

Anyway: here the same goes as for the Orks. I would want all positionals, the big guy, and in case of skaven about 8 linemen.

[Duke Jan]

First of all welcome, I hope you will enjoy the game as much as most people around here do.

In general you will start a league team with relatively many linemen and few positionals (blitzers, catchers etc), especially when playing a team with expensive positionals. Some coaches start their team with 12 linemen to get the re-rolls cheap and to stop the positionals from stealing all the SPP. When your team is developed you will have the maximum number of positionals and the rest filled out with a few linemen. Whether 4 catchers on the pitch is too many depends on your style of play, but with AV7 it is always a good idea to have at least 3, in case one misses the match. About Blitzers and Black Orcs there's no discussion, take as many as you're allowed to on your developed team. The other kind of mini you will want to use is a big guy, an ogre, a rat ogre and a troll for the teams you mentioned.

To what extend it is allowed to play with the wrong minis depends mostly on your opponent. Most people won't make a fuzz about you using the wrong players, as long as it's clear what is what. When you do it is better to use human linemen for linerats than to use storm vermin. If you want to learn how to develop your teams, look in the Website Chat section, there's a thread there about online and play by e-mail leagues. In most of these leagues the rosters are visible to anyone, so you can look at how coaches develop their teams and playing in these leagues will teach you a thing or two, although playing the table top game is not quite the same as playing over the web.

[TedStriker]

Thanks for the replies. Based on the advice I posted in the trade forum. Hopefully somebody can help me out of my skaven dilemma.

I was a little miffed at 4 SV in my box. But it was shrinkwrapped and the box was sealed. If it was tampered with/cherry picked, the guy was a pro . There was absolutely no box damage at all. Based on the shipping costs, and the fact that I didn't buy from GWMO, I haven't even considered trying to get it corrected. Oh well.

You guys mentioned the big guys. At this point, I was given a Morg-n-thorg by my LGS owner, and traded for a Ripper Bolgrot (also at my LGS). In the same vein as my last question, is it permissable to play star players as their common counterpart (ogre, troll)? I assume the answer is the same as for the other players (if your LGS/opponent says cool.. then ok, but should probably have right models for tournament). I ask these questions as more etiquette than anything. However, even though I suck now (only 3 games hell), I may be attending Gen Con Indy and have a chance to sneak in a game or 2. I would hate to be not eligible to play BB because I don't have the right models. If I play, you guys need to draw me in the tournament... very easy win .

Thanks for the online pointers for roster examples. I will investigate them. Is Fummbl (sp?) the most popular online option?

[wesleytj]

actually to be honest, even my tr100 orcs never use line orcs. 2 throwers, 4 blitzers, 4 bob, and a goblin or two make up my starting roster. line orcs get bought after apoth and troll if i feel the need to have a long bench, or to replace the goblin on the field when facing a tackle team.

but that's not really the point of the thread. back on topic, as someone else said, you generally buy your team up to fill all the possible position placements in lieu of linemen. so to figure your optional miniature allocation, you want to work up your starting roster, and make sure you have enough line men/orcs/rats/elves or whatever to field those first few games. after that just get the max of each specialty player.

also, if your roster allows big guys, you'll want to get one of those. if you actually get options on which big guy you want, put a little thought into it. there aren't many of these, though...chaos and chaos dwarves are the only ones that spring to mind at the moment.

on a related note, i suggest painting your line men/rats/orcs/elves first, particularly if you're new to painting. you can use the first few guys to figure out exactly what your color scheme is, and also to get practice with the whole painting thing in general. then by the time you get to your position players, they (hopefully) look sharp and well colored, and as you buy more and more of them, the most poorly painted line men/orcs/rats/elves can ride the bench or get retired.

final note: i really doubt your box was tampered with...nobody in their right mind would get you EXTRA positionals at the expense of line rats. It woulda been the other way around. Just call GW mail order and tell them what is going on, they'll send you replacements for free! and let you keep the extra vermin!

anyway, hope that helps.

[Duke Jan]

There's hardly any official Big Guy miniatures, so most people use the starplayer minis for them anyway. At most tournaments this won't be a problem since few tournaments allow starplayers.

For the human team the new metal team is perfect I think

2 throwers
4 blitzers
4 catchers
6 linemen

Add an ogre and some stars and you have everything you may ever need to play humans.

[edit]Almost forgot. To see which minis are which edition etcetera Traveller's page is a good one: http://www.blood-bowl-miniatures.de/ [/edit]

[fen]

Not only does it have everything you'd ever want for a human team (minus the Ogre + Stars), but GW charged me £20 for it. Which was, rather nice.