Skill Selection Timeline

Eric R. · Post by **Eric R.** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:58 am

It may be a league-to-league thing, but I find it interesting the amount of 'Team development' posts I keep seeing when my understanding was that the skill must be chosen in front of you last opponent.

The LRB does not specify the timeline, but I always understood that it must be in front of your last opponent (i.e. at the end of your last match).

Just wondering if there is an 'official' procedure, or is it up to the league?

Glowworm · Post by **Glowworm** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:56 am

I usually like to make the roll for improvement with my opponent watching just in case its a double or 10/11/12. If its a "normal" roll then fine I mostly have a skill in mind already, if its something special then I might wait to post (on TBB) for advice as I dont want to a bad choice (I dont roll many doubles!) Its a choice your league has to make, altho' you (as league Commish) can rule on it to stop any abuse. I have never met the "while you where at the toilet I rolled a double 6" guy but after reading some stories on this forum have no doubt he may exist!

I ran a league where you rolled immediately at the end of the match, had no complaints!

Hope this helps....

The Souljourner · Post by **The Souljourner** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 2:30 pm

We definitely require the roll to be done in front of another player, but after that, bah, it doesn't matter. Take your time in choosing. Not like it matters until the beginning of the next game you play anyway.

Then again, we post our teams online so we can all see everyone's teams at all times, so it's not that big of a deal.

Cramy · Post by **Cramy** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 3:28 pm

The skill roll must be done in front of your opponent so that the roll can be captured: single, double, stats increase. After that, the skill or stat increase selection can be done after the fact in the leagues that I have played in.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:13 pm

Agreed with C&S... as long as the roll is witnessed (by your last opponent/commish if you think "sleight of dice" may be involved) choose the skill before the next game....

Warpstone · Post by **Warpstone** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:21 pm

As above, our game reports only require the skill roll to be noted and you're good with the skill choice so long as you get it into the commish before your next game day.

Jural · Post by **Jural** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:50 pm

We do all our rolls in person, but we invariably forget one or two... SO we use the random dice simulator at irony games and e-mail the results to the commish or the league as a whole.

Smeborg · Post by **Smeborg** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:36 pm

The almost universal convention followed by groups I have played in is:

- Roll the dice immediately following the game with your opponent as witness.

- Choose the skill at you leisure, but obviously before the next game begins (!).

Personally, I try to pick the skill immediately - this is both the letter and spirit of the rulebook. If you have a clear team development plan, it is easy to do.

Hope this helps.

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:20 pm

According to the rules skill selection must be made during the post game sequence along with everything else.

Many leagues understand that some thought might be required so allow people to vary their post-game procedures until the start of the next game.

In a fixed schedule league this can be a good idea since it removes any advantage of playing your game after your next opponent (i.e. you get to see the result of their post game before deciding your own).

AK_Dave · Post by **AK_Dave** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 11:48 pm

I don't see a strict timeline spelled out in the post-game sequence. We interpret it a little loosely here also.

zephard · Post by **zephard** » Tue Dec 30, 2008 5:52 pm

I play all PBeM so it has to be chosen within a day, since the league I play in says at least a turn a day. It has to be final by the submitting of the game file, so if I have questions I wait a few hours here, normal get some kind of answer before choosing.

Axtklinge · Post by **Axtklinge** » Tue Dec 30, 2008 6:59 pm

Like others before, in our league we roll all the dice in the end of the game, in front of the opponent (from times to times something is fogotten, and those rolles are made either next time the players meet to play, or by any online dice simulator).

As for the skills, most of the times the coach already knows what to give to the player. When thats not the case, the coach can think it over and mail the commish with is choice.

Cheers
Axt

Mad Jackal · Post by **Mad Jackal** » Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:21 pm

ianwilliams wrote:According to the rules skill selection must be made during the post game sequence along with everything else.

Many leagues understand that some thought might be required so allow people to vary their post-game procedures until the start of the next game.

In a fixed schedule league this can be a good idea since it removes any advantage of playing your game after your next opponent (i.e. you get to see the result of their post game before deciding your own).

ian, not to be argumentative I am simply asking for help finding it s I was sure it was there too...
Which text are you saying says they must ?

I looked during the post match where the rules say you must make the improvement rolls , but don't see any text that says you make the skill selections..

Jural · Post by **Jural** » Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:23 pm

The skill selections must happen in the post-match sequence... But there is no wording in the rulebook which claims how long the post-match sequence lasts.

As a matter of fact, since there are only 3 time periods defined (post match, pre-match, and match) then either the post match or the pre-match extends for a number of weeks!

Rolling for advances is the first step in the post match sequence, but nowhere does it state that choosing skills must occur at any specific tim relative to the other post match events (although there is text to the effect that an advance must be recorded on the team roster before the next match...)

Smeborg · Post by **Smeborg** » Tue Dec 30, 2008 8:34 pm

Mad Jackal - on page 29 of LRB6 (draft) section 2. Update Team Roster point 1. it says: "...and record any changes to a player's value for improvements."

This clearly implies you must pick the skill and change the record during the post-match sequence. But this is not as strong as a clear statement.

I suggest that the BBRC might like to consider inserting a clear statement somewhere (presumably on page 26) to the effect that coaches must immediately pick skills for players who have passed the relevant SPP threshold(s).

In my experience (in a variety of countries) coaches are typically lazy (or do not understand the rule) and defer their skill pick until later (although they make the rolls during the post-match).

Ian makes the good point that if you defer the skill pick until you know your next opponent, it gives you an undue advantage (e.g. I face stunties, I pick Tackle). So a minor wording change to the rules might be an appropriate solution.

Hope this helps.