Frenzy + Stand Firm - why is it a must have?

[Trollblanc]

Why is stand firm a "must have" on a frenzy player - especially the werewolves with great movement?
Do blocks into the crowd with frenzy happen that regularely? If I use a blitz I can just move the wolf out again can't I?

[Ulthuan_Express]

When you're trying to get someone out in the crowd, it doesn't always (in fact, rarely does) come from a nice, easy frenzied blitz. With players who can mitigate against this, you often find a small chain push is required, and the two blocks that Frenzy players get from a standing position is hugely beneficial. That said, they'll end up on the sideline, and unless you can protect them (or there's no-one capable of getting to them), a good opponent will try and give your Frenzy player the old heave-ho to follow their poor teammate into the fans.

It's a bit little like taking Pile On without having Jump Up. Sure, it's a great skill, but when you use it in certain circumstances... well, it's like throwing your opponent a bone.

[Joemanji]

Also, you may have used all your movement getting to the surf, or getting away may require a dodge roll, or your opponent might have Frenzy players of his own etc...

[Trollblanc]

Hmm ok thank you - beeing rather new I didn't see many chain pushes for the frenzy block then - but mostly blitzes

[El Hombre]

to be honest, I'd prefer Side Step over Stand Firm anyday. Chance of getting in the crowd yourself is much smaller (although not eliminated as with SF), but it's much more usefull in other in-game-situations... For some players it's also the cheapest (value-wise) option of the 2.

[Ulthuan_Express]

to be honest, I'd prefer Side Step over Stand Firm anyday. Chance of getting in the crowd yourself is much smaller (although not eliminated as with SF), but it's much more usefull in other in-game-situations... For some players it's also the cheapest (value-wise) option of the 2.

Depends on the player, whether they have Strength or Agility access. A Stand firm Wardancer (or any Elf with Block, really), for instance, is fairly pointless and very expensive, while a Sidestepping one is great and easy to get. Switch it round and a Sidestepping Trollslayer is still fun, but Stand Firm comes around far more easily. Ditto Black Orcs, Chaos Warriors, etc

[Dzerards]

A Wolf or Witch Elf would go with side-step rather than stand firm surely, but both skills rock with Frenzy. Just watch out for juggernaut minotaurs if you go stand firm!

[Joemanji]

Side Step is better with regard to Frenzy players avoiding counter-surfs. A Stand Firm guy will stay put, but a SS-er can swing round and counter-counter-surf the counter-surfer next turn! But it's true that the best option is the one the player has easiest access to.

[Chosen Warrior]

One or the other might be better in different situations, but when you roll a double it's kind of wasted on a skill that is similar to what you could pick on a normal roll. Not just because of the 30k vs 20k value, but also because instead you could pick something else. An orc blitzer would probably be better off picking Dodge or Jump up with the double, and elven blitzers might prefer Guard or Mighty blow. So pick the positioning skill you have regular access to.

[Corvidius]

I've really enjoyed using a Sidestep Minotaur in tournament or league play. I'm not saying it's a game winner but it is fun. I'd love a Sidestep, Break Tackle, Tentacles Mino but I never keep a Chaos team long enough.

[juck101]

Actually ubber sexy players with SS have been surfed into the crowd at times. I think SF is better with frenzy if you have the choice but that might be elf specific advice. Either SS or SF is great as you dont take a crowd surf back

[Ullis]

As Joemanji pointed out, the benefit of Stand Firm is not only in not getting surfed yourself but in setting up surfing opportunities for next turn as your player cannot be pushed (and hence followed up on or clearing a tackle zone) by an opponent close to the sideline.

I don't really see Stand Firm as a must have skill for Frenzy players. For example, Mighty Blow and Guard are great skills too.

[DoubleSkulls]

If you play the sidelines a lot then SF/SS can be better

The benefit is really about enabling you to surf using normal blocks, because you aren't worried about the follow up surf.