Wait a second: Foul casualties don't count?

McTavish · Post by **McTavish** » Sat Jul 12, 2003 10:26 am

An annoying rules-lawyer type (okay, so there's nothing wrong with rules lawyering, he's really just annoying on his own merits) recently informs me that casualties inflicted via fouling do not count for SPP's.

Is this true?

I have been gleefully fouling away for the course of a couple months' worth of games and counted every one of the casualties that resulted for points. To cease counting them would prove very difficult, being that as I didn't know there was a difference, I didn't keep track of any difference. Also, to do so would downgrade several of my players multiple levels worth... would I keep the same Star Player rolls, then? I got a couple nice ones, like a doubles and a +1 STR roll...

I mean, if this turns out to be true I've essentially been cheating for months.

ljm · Post by **ljm** » Sat Jul 12, 2003 10:42 am

He's right. Fouling casualties don't count for SPP's. Only blocks do.

ljm

McTavish · Post by **McTavish** » Sat Jul 12, 2003 11:47 am

Oh, bugger.

Now I've got to attempt to figure out which of them are illegal and retroactively crap out my guys so that I don't get called on it...

Mestari · Post by **Mestari** » Sat Jul 12, 2003 1:28 pm

And if you're looking for a reason why this is so, just look at those players of yours. Fouling is a too easy way of upgrading your players. In the 3rd edition where you got SPP's from fouling, getting Dirty Player often meant that the player soon got a lot more skills.

Giving SPP's for fouling is a cheesy powergaming tool.

slackman · Post by **slackman** » Sun Jul 13, 2003 5:54 am

aye, fouling cas have been a long time gone. how long since you guys last played a league? but dont fret, there were quite a few changes when i rejoined the community i didnt realize at first either.

slackman42

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Jul 13, 2003 7:37 am

I have to admit that I've come round to the 'no SPP for fouling' camp as well, especially after playing in the REBBL Skaven league (where I think it has it's place).

Post by **Old Man Draco** » Tue Jul 15, 2003 1:22 pm

Well, youre not the only cheat in the game. I to noticed on this forum that no more SPP's are awarded. However, my friends are still a bit stuck with the 3rd Ed rules so I take advantage of it all the time!
I'm I right when I say that the casualties do count for the FF throw at the end of the game?

Skummy · Post by **Skummy** » Tue Jul 15, 2003 1:32 pm

Draco wrote:I'm I right when I say that the casualties do count for the FF throw at the end of the game?

Well, there's a lot of debate about that. It's one of the rules questions up for the BBRC to look over in the fall, and I'm honestly not sure what the answer will be. I'd say stick with your house rule for now and wait for the official word.

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Tue Jul 15, 2003 10:53 pm

i think i'm still the only holdout that thinks cas for fouling should still count. i think that the IGMEOY rule and the weakening of skills like dirty player, mighty blow, and pro (with regard to fouling) are more than enough to keep fouling to a manageable level, AND that it actually causes harm to lower fouling this much because now there's no in-game mechanism to encourage player turnover, which is why we have to have stupid rules that everyone hates like ageing.

but yes, as far as what the current ruling is, they are correct. you do NOT get spp from fouling or crowd-inflicted cas.

tik · Post by **tik** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 10:23 am

I'm not entirely certain that a crowd casualty does not count to the player blocking the other into the crowd. The rules have it that you only get spp for a casualty when a player blocks or is blocked... pushing a player into the crowd is a block after all.
any thoughts on this?

Post by **Old Man Draco** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 10:45 am

AFAIK you are very correct. Pushing a player in the crowd that causes an injury does give you SPP's.

Deacon · Post by **Deacon** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 11:18 am

Hmm...

Think you might be slightly incorrect about SPP for crowd casualties, gentlemen.

Pretty sure the ruling is NO spp for pushbacks into the crowd. The crowd causes the casualty (pg.11 - LRB).

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 11:44 am

deacon is right, crowd cas don't give spp

Asmodan · Post by **Asmodan** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 11:44 am

no casuality for pushing a player into the crowd.
You only ever get for casualities caused by blocks.

Post by **Old Man Draco** » Thu Aug 14, 2003 11:54 am

This question has been on the board before. Read the next thread.

viewtopic.php?t=6098&highlight=spp+crowd

I still don't think it is clearly stated. The injury is caused because of a block by a player. The crowd beating him up should even give you bonus because there is nothing more fun for the crowd than give a player a good beating!

Maybe Galak can give more info as how the rule is to be read. Or maybe Grumbledook will do so, instead of only stating that is in the rules.