Old World Pact: Only Treemen instead of Ogre access?

narkotic · Post by **narkotic** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 1:34 pm

Does anyone know what the pact teams will look like after BRC 2003? Having the Ogre removed from some teams soon, it even more seems inapropriate for Old Wolrd Teams (fluffwise): Elfs, Dwarfs, Hobbits, Ents and an Ogre? What about giving them only 2 Treemen? I know that will make the old world pact even less competetive in comparison to the evil pact team, but maybe you could tweak it a little more (less RR cost etc.). What do you think? Anyone has info about the route this team will go in the future?

Robotorz · Post by **Robotorz** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:18 pm

Well I like Trees more than Ogres so I would love to see that happen (after Take Root became a on pitch skill) but I think it will make the Old World Team too strong (have to test it)

BlanchPrez · Post by **BlanchPrez** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:26 pm

I think that the Pact teams should be one big guy as with normal teams, with several choices to pick from.

Chris

narkotic · Post by **narkotic** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:41 pm

OK, apart from the fact that pact teams really should have only one big guy, I think an old world pact with 1 Treeman and 1 Ogre is definitely stronger than with 2 Treemen. And if they ever become one big guy only (which I doubt, they are currently thinking of reducing them from 3 to 2 at evil pact), an Ogre seems horribly ill placed among old worlders.

Piepgrass · Post by **Piepgrass** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 6:03 pm

Actually a ogre is not that ill placed fluffwise.

Ogres have a long history of "working" with the empire in the Warhammer world as mercenaries (and occasionally as allies)

regards Poul

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 7:17 pm

Gotta agree, I've always associated Ogres more with the Empire than I ever did with chaos.

narkotic · Post by **narkotic** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 7:31 pm

Well, it's not the problem of Empire/Humans and Ogres but Ogres with Dwarfs, Elfs, Hobbits and Ents.

Robotorz · Post by **Robotorz** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 7:35 pm

I am pro 2 Big guys for Old World Teams and I totaly support the Idea of a Ogre in a Old World Team fluff wise and game balance wise.
I rate Trees better than Ogres for a Old World team.

Btw. The Old World, the Lustrian and the Chaos Pact team have absolutley a lack of Positional Players and thats why they have 2 Big Guys and not 1 and I like it that way

Dark Lord (retired) · Post by **Dark Lord (retired)** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 7:59 pm

Oh you don't even wanna hear me wail if Ogres are on a team with dwarfs and elfs!!! BAH!!!!!

Robotorz · Post by **Robotorz** » Thu Aug 28, 2003 10:12 pm

Are we talking about your Opinion of how a fairy tale world should look like, about balancing the game or the WFB World?

If we talk about how your fairy tale world should look like then your the boss Darklord do what ever you want

If we talk about balancing the game I am against 2 Trees (especialy if Take Root becomes a on pitch characteristic).

And If we talk about the WFB World than the Empire Army List featured Anno 1992 Humans,Ogres, Halflings and Dwarfs. Furthermore you could allie with even more Dwarfs, High and Wood Elfs. And you realy want to tell me Ogres dont fit here fluffwise? Think again!

Dark Lord (retired) · Thu Aug 28, 2003 11:57 pm

Robotorz wrote:Are we talking about your Opinion of how a fairy tale world should look like, about balancing the game or the WFB World?

If we talk about how your fairy tale world should look like then your the boss Darklord do what ever you want

If we talk about balancing the game I am against 2 Trees (especialy if Take Root becomes a on pitch characteristic).

And If we talk about the WFB World than the Empire Army List featured Anno 1992 Humans,Ogres, Halflings and Dwarfs. Furthermore you could allie with even more Dwarfs, High and Wood Elfs. And you realy want to tell me Ogres dont fit here fluffwise? Think again!

#1. WHFB "has no bearing Blood Bowl" Or so they say.
#2. Fluff is no excuse for lack of balance. Or else the Humans would have 0-4 flings.
#3. No team should have more than 1 big guy.
#4. The Old World and Chaos Pact are thought to be out of whack by more than a couple coaches.
#5. Ogres were removed from Dwarf teams and aren't on any Elf teams. They were recently removed from several teams because of balance issues. Orcs can have them in WHFB but not in Blood Bowl.

Post by **Thadrin** » Fri Aug 29, 2003 8:02 am

I'd rather see them ditch the elves completely and make it the Empire team rather than the Old World team. You could go back to the old rules of 4 longbeards too.

I mean, does:
0-12 Human Linemen
0-4 Longbeards
0-2 Halflings
0-1 Ogre OR Treeman
0-2 Position players (Human or Dwarf)

REALLY seem broken? Not to me it doesn't...and it fits the fluff quite nicely too.

Robotorz · Post by **Robotorz** » Fri Aug 29, 2003 9:28 am

The Oldworld Team I use is:

Code: Select all

5  Human Lineman
4  Long Beard
2 Halfling
2   Wood Elf Lineman
1   Human Blitzer
1  treeman
1    Ogre

From PH Team Analysis it gets following values:

Code: Select all

Blocking  86,08   
Throwing    53,92   
Running 53,32   
Potential   57,55   
Pricing 46,86   
Power   70,42   
Cost    1.090.000   
Value   48,44

And the values are realy NOT hight from my opinion. Dont forget the 80k rerolls and the lack of positional players when talking about these teams. If you realy think these values are strong then you would have to mess around with a lot of the teams!

Editet Part: I only tryed to explain narcotic that they fit in quite well, since he was of oposit opinion... I dont mix BB fluff with WFB. I am not JJ who does a Khemri team and nukes the old Undead

If you want to compare the above numbers with the original Cockerel then go to http://www.blood-bowl.net/BloodBowlPlayers.html and download the zip file called Pink Horrors team analysis...