Team Re-Roll Question #2

[Full_Block]

Okay, second question. I think, as far as re-rolls go, we’re all agreed upon the following, right?

You cannot use a re-roll...

a) on anyone or thing other than a player (“A coach may use a team re-roll to re-roll a dice roll for an action carried out by a player in their own team during their own team turn.”; LRB page 15)

b) on anything other than action (“A coach may use a team re-roll to re-roll a dice roll for an action carried out by a player in their own team during their own team turn.”; LRB page 15)

c) when it isn’t your turn. (“A coach may use a team re-roll to re-roll a dice roll for an action carried out by a player in their own team during their own team turn.”; LRB page 15)

Is that all correct?

Assuming that it is, it begs the question, when can you use re-rolls? Yes, I’m sure you’re all shaking your head and muttering that I’ve just answered that question... but I haven’t. You see, the LRB makes a very clear point that: “A coach that suffers a turnover must end his turn [u]immediately[/u] – even if part way through a player’s action.” (LRB, page eight)

So imagine the scene: your Thrower goes to pick up the ball and fails. This immediately causes a turnover (LRB, page eight). It is now your opponent’s turn and therefore you cannot use a re-roll of any kind to re-roll the attempt to pick up the ball (because that breaks point C).

Note the word “immediately.” It doesn’t say: “A coach that suffers a turnover must end his turn, even if part way through a player’s action, unless he can use a skill or Team Re-Roll to re-roll the action and is then successful.” This would make sense and fit with how most people play the game. But that’s not the case.

Note also that the very next line of text reads: "The only exception to this is that Armour rolls and injury must still be made for players that have been knocked over.” Aside from the unclear wording here (injury what?), this statement is also very clear. The [u]only exceptions[/u] are Armour and Injury rolls. Not re-rolls. Nothing else.

Can anyone help me with this?

[ScottyBoneman]

You can't get too exacting in the language of the rules in many cases. Immediately is given too much stregth here.

[Full_Block]

[quote]You can't get too exacting in the language of the rules in many cases. Immediately is given too much stregth here.[/quote]

Immediately is given no strength at all. And if you can't be exacting in rules, where can you be? Read what the rules say. It contradicts the way the game is played, surely?

[ScottyBoneman]

Immediately is given no strength at all. And if you can't be exacting in rules, where can you be? Read what the rules say. It contradicts the way the game is played, surely?

You do say 'note immediately'- I think that does qualify as giving strength. I believe the intention was to say that no other actions to are to be taken, including by the active player but it does not negate the function of the reroll. Lots of other areas of the book endup superceding these blanket statements when going into details of skills, other rules, etc.

[Full_Block]

[quote]Lots of other areas of the book endup superceding these blanket statements when going into details of skills, other rules, etc.[/quote]
Give me an example of any mention of a re-roll in the LRB that says that you can use a re-roll in your opponent's turn. All other references to re-rolls I can find say that you can use them when you roll badly but still while it is only your turn. According to the turnover rules, it is no longer your turn.

[ScottyBoneman]

Lots of other areas of the book endup superceding these blanket statements when going into details of skills, other rules, etc.

Give me an example of any mention of a re-roll in the LRB that says that you can use a re-roll in your opponent's turn. All other references to re-rolls I can find say that you can use them when you roll badly but still while it is only your turn. According to the turnover rules, it is no longer your turn.

Well, since you seem to have a deep love for being overly technical, I will supply that.

The rule on Pg. 15 under rerolls doesn't actually say that you can't use a reroll on your opponents turn. It says that the roll being rerolled must have taken place in their own turn by their own player- a dodge is specifically used as an example of what can be rerolled.

[Longshot]

it is not a turnover till the thrower say it...he can use a rerrol to prevent it. same for skills.

stop trying to see the weak point when they arent any there!

[Darkson]

A re-roll is not taking the action again, but skill/luck meaning it was actually completed. The action is not over until the re-roll is used.

[Goryus]

Exactly. A turnover doesn't occur until the result of your dice rolls has been finalized; this includes applying modifiers and using rerolls. If you fumble the ball, it's a turnover, but you will never have fumbled in the first place if you rerolled and succeeded.

['Ed Basha']

and to add to that, you can use a re-roll on your opponents turn for a couple of sprecific things....you can re-roll a shadowing attempt, and at least one other thing, but I can't remember what it is right now

[MixX]

Are you certain that you can reroll a shadowing move?? I know you can reroll a catch attempt if you have the catch skill, but that's a skill reroll, not a team rr...

[Darkson]

You can re-roll shadowing if you use it in your turn (ie shadow a shadower), but I'm pretty certain you can't use a TRR to shadow in your opponents turn, or use a TRR for any action in your opponents turn in fact.

[DoubleSkulls]

you can use a re-roll on your opponents turn

No you can't. You can only ever use a RR during your own turn.

[Mike_Black]

@Full_block
If you say so and stick to "immediate" you can't use skills either.

Because:
(p.34) 2. All skills may be uses once per action....

but your action is finished after you failed your action (pass, block, catch, ....)

[narkotic]

Team RRs: only in your own turns
Skill based RRs: in your and your opponents turn (eg catch for interception, pro for shadowing etc.)