Vampire Tournament Strategies

Emberbreeze · Post by **Emberbreeze** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:27 pm

Ok, I'm going to be giving my Dark Elves a break at some point and my next tournament team is going to be Vampires (because I already have the models)

I'm playing a couple of PBeM games to see how they play before I take them anywhere (they need painting too) and I'm just asking for opinions on team roster and skill choice. I know this will be mostly hypothetical as the roster hasn't been legal long enough for anyone to use it.

I've started off with a 3 vampires, 9 Thralls and 4 rerolls roster. I think this is give enough positionals with enough rerolls to keep them reliable.

I don't think failing OFAB in tournment play is that critical if you have a thrall in the right position to keep play moving in the direction you want.

So far I've only had to break a cage once, and HG worked like a dream, but as a tactic it needs a reroll available for when you fail the 3+ roll. It wont take people long to develop new forms of cage where you can keep extra tackle zones to reduce the HG roll.

Emberbreeze · Post by **Emberbreeze** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:33 pm

(sorry for the 2 posts, Work firewall limits the post size)

I haven't worked out a clear attacking Strategy using HG yet

As for skills, I think block on all the vamps is a no brainer. with my elves I would take dodge in preference to block as it has the same effect in defence and gives you extra mobility. but with ST4 block I think is the way forward.

once the 3 vamps have block I was thinking sure hands on a thrall. saves keeping a vamp back for the kick off. any other ideas for skills on thralls.

If more than 1 skill is allowed then Blodge on vamps will make them awesome maybe guard too for making those thralls better on the font line.

Anyone else have any ideas?

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 3:53 pm

Emberbreeze wrote:I haven't worked out a clear attacking Strategy using HG yet

As for skills, I think block on all the vamps is a no brainer. with my elves I would take dodge in preference to block as it has the same effect in defence and gives you extra mobility. but with ST4 block I think is the way forward.

once the 3 vamps have block I was thinking sure hands on a thrall. saves keeping a vamp back for the kick off. any other ideas for skills on thralls.

If more than 1 skill is allowed then Blodge on vamps will make them awesome maybe guard too for making those thralls better on the font line.

Anyone else have any ideas?

Forget Block... Pro is the absolute no-brainer for a Vampire's 1st skill, in a tournament or otherwise.

You get to reroll failed Bloodlust rolls, reducing the chance of failing one from 16.7% to 9.7%! That is a massive difference. Then, assuming that most turns you don't fail Bloodlust, you still have the Pro roll left over, and it can be used on Hypnotic Gazes, blocks, dodges and everything else.

I would be looking at Sure Hands, Kick and Tackle (as your only way to deal with Gutter Runners) as skills for your Thralls.

Skills are the easy part... tactics are a lot harder. The Vamps may be ST 4 and AG 4, but a bashy team will out-muscle you, and a finesse team will out-agile you. The biggest strength of your team on offence is a high ST ball carrier who can dodge away, and has HG support. Best advice I can think of is to use HG early on, just so your opponent knows how it works and knows you will use it. Then use it as a psychological tool, hopefully to force some errors. Realistically though, this is a fun team, not a tourney winner IMO.

Cheers
Joe

Emberbreeze · Post by **Emberbreeze** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:12 pm

the problem with pro, is once you fail the roll do you risk the 50/50 chance of not rerolling it with Pro, or do you use a reroll to make sure you get it.

I can see it being useful once you have used your reroll, and for a failed OFAB where is isn't critical.

what are the odds of a turn over on a 2 die block when you have pro, and when you have block?

I think I need to play a mid tournament developed team with both and see which I prefer.

Emberbreeze · Post by **Emberbreeze** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:14 pm

Realistically though, this is a fun team, not a tourney winner IMO.

I know, I play dark elves atm, so I never expect to win tournaments. My aim is to win more than I loose, and I think Vamps are capable of that.

edit - my massive posting session today as raised my posts per day to 1.00

juck101 · Post by **juck101** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 7:34 pm

god knows how they play at tourni level, but for my 10cents dodge is a very good skill. Plenty will have block, and plenty of st4 will have other skills - not block. Thus block helps less for my money than in league play ( just an idea) Dodge would be usefull but so much to take. Would never play without tackle at top level, guard, even stripball all essential really.

I do understand the Pro thing but think vamps need to ride there luck when the having a good turn - and only a skill aids your ability. Either play option A) safe game using thralls to maximum and solid game, or B) erratic mad vampire based turn and ignore the OFAB. Cant say which will work but vamp have the potential to pull of any move - surely the appeal.

3 vamps- few thralls - loads of rerolls

MickeX · Post by **MickeX** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 2:06 am

I've played vamps a bit on FUMBBL, and I don't believe too much in Pro. Insetad, use only 2 vamps and a lot off RRs. Don't move vamps unless you have to! Keep the rolls down and you'll be fine with 5 RRs.

Block is essential to blitz ballcarriers. I try getting all my vampires Blodge - the important thing with them is that they must be all-rounders.

inquisitorpustus · Post by **inquisitorpustus** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 2:33 am

Yeah I wouldn't bother with pro until late on in their development.

After block, dodge, tackle, guard and mighty blow probably.

If you get the mix of vamps to re-rolls right you should be fine.

Emberbreeze · Post by **Emberbreeze** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 10:21 am

thanks inquisitorpustus, but it wont help me much in tournament play when I will get 1 at most 2 skills per vamp

Also I agree 1 or 2 vamps is a good starting roster for league play, but in a tournament it doesn't matter is I kill a thrall or 2 as they will come back next game, so more vamps less rerolls I think should make me more effective. With careful placing of thralls, failing an OFAB isn't a big deal.

MickeX · Post by **MickeX** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 10:32 am

Emberbreeze wrote: Also I agree 1 or 2 vamps is a good starting roster for league play, but in a tournament it doesn't matter is I kill a thrall or 2 as they will come back next game, so more vamps less rerolls I think should make me more effective. With careful placing of thralls, failing an OFAB isn't a big deal.

I think you're mistaken here. One of the main problems with vampire teams is that they tend to lack players on pitch. Those AV7 guys get stunned, KOs and worse all the time, and you need them to screen your vamps, keep a cage from rolling and so on.

This is especially true against bashy teams, where you might only get three drives in the whole match. By turn 8, you're bound to have very few players out there.

Emberbreeze · Post by **Emberbreeze** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 11:07 am

I just won my 1st ever game with Vamps Vs Dwarf Coaches Lizards

and I didn't find my thralls were overly hurt by all the ST4 and ST5 about the place. I hurt his skinks more

maybe I was a bit lucky he only got 2 cas, and he did only break my AV7 4 times

With a spare player I was only 1 man down at most.

against teams with lots of block I would suffer badly as I would take alot more knockdowns.

I failed OFAB and had to injure a thrall 3 times, once with a reroll.

I clearly need lots more games, but from this game, and the one I'm playing V skaven I like having 3 vamps.

dwarfcoach · Post by **dwarfcoach** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 11:57 am

I think that Ember has it right, it does seem that 3 Vamps is the way to go for tourneys.

I have to say that you were very fortunate with your armour roles and that played a signifcant part in your victory. It is a bit risky having only 11 players when 8 of them only have AV7. I think maybe going with 1 less re-roll and 1 extra player may give the team a bit more longevity. But otherwise I think that in the 2nd half you were really getting the grips with the team, a deeper and tighter formation with the Vamps looks to be the way to go.

Roll on the 2nd game

.

kithor2002 · Post by **kithor2002** » Thu Dec 16, 2004 12:25 pm

I would stick to your 12 player roster with 3 vamps and as other mentioned block would be a very good first skill choice.

Emberbreeze · Post by **Emberbreeze** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 9:52 am

Well my other game V skaven has just taken turn for the worse, with me infilcating 2 cas on myself in 1 turn. 1 from OFAB (last turn of the half, no rerolls, trying to hurt some of those pesky rats) and 1 from blocking (stupid 1 die block)

already 2 casulties down, so we shall see how I fair against skaven while 3 players down. Not well I guess

juck101 · Post by **juck101** » Sat Dec 18, 2004 8:03 pm

of any team the vamp CAN go mental in a good turn with lots of dice, but in general turns may achieve very little. I would expect any decent player to 'ride them like a stolen car' as seams only way to get full use from ag4/st4. A conservative play style will get them killed.

( painting them soon so may be wiser in 05 )