Why strong arm is a trait and not accurate ?

Bevan · Post by **Bevan** » Sat Sep 07, 2002 10:47 pm

Darkson wrote: What I was saying is that if Accurate is so much better as neverdodge was arguing, why would a player take stronarm, even if they did rol a double?

A thrower with a double would take Strong Arm rather than Accurate because they can pick up accurate next time, but you just have to grab those doubles when you can get them.

However, the thrower might expect never to get both skills e.g. they would take Block next time or the team will disband before the thrower gets another skill. Then it means they can't make any use of that double, which is a pity.

So, your original point is valid that traits should be better than skills and it would't be too hard to just rewrite the skill description so that the effects are reversed. Would that cause more confusion than the current imbalance between the skill and trait?

neverdodge · Post by **neverdodge** » Sun Sep 08, 2002 8:24 am

Bevan wrote:
So, your original point is valid that traits should be better than skills and it would't be too hard to just rewrite the skill description so that the effects are reversed. Would that cause more confusion than the current imbalance between the skill and trait?

wow the boy from tasmania got it, just what i was thinking, finally someone understand me

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Sun Sep 08, 2002 8:48 pm

No, getting a trait give you a 'bonus' to the other players who dont get one.
So a thrower with SA will be better than Accurate.cos he can potentialy get the 2 skill/trait but not the second one.
A trait musnt be a better than a skill for me.

Trambi · Post by **Trambi** » Mon Sep 09, 2002 3:42 pm

Physical traits are better than Physical skills

Longshot · Post by **Longshot** » Mon Sep 09, 2002 8:09 pm

but that is not the rules that is set between traits and skills.

Skummy · Post by **Skummy** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 3:52 pm

I'm coming in a little late here... but Strong Arm is also better than Accurate for two reasons I haven't yet seen on this thread. It increases the range you can throw in Dungeonbowl, and it increases the range you can throw with a dump off pass. Dump off passes can be thrown only to quick, and strong arm makes all your ranges go up by one. Throwing a dump off to anyone in a short distance is substantially better, and in many cases can really help you out when you are in trouble on offence.

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 3:56 pm

Just what I was thinking but I hadn't read all the posts yet.

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 3:59 pm

Skummy wrote:I'm coming in a little late here... but Strong Arm is also better than Accurate for two reasons I haven't yet seen on this thread. It increases the range you can throw in Dungeonbowl, and it increases the range you can throw with a dump off pass. Dump off passes can be thrown only to quick, and strong arm makes all your ranges go up by one. Throwing a dump off to anyone in a short distance is substantially better, and in many cases can really help you out when you are in trouble on offence.

Incorrect. Strong Arm reduces the range band by 1, and you can't reduce a Quick Pass any further.

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 4:03 pm

I think what he meant was that all passed through the short band become quick passes. That would allow a Dump Off for half the range ruler. There are also weather rolls that affect range. Allowing Strong Arm to increase the allowable range makes it a worthwhile trait.

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 4:27 pm

Strong Arm does not allow you to Dump Off to Short Pass range.

Edit: Check the FAQs sticky:

Can a player with Strong Arm effectively dump off up to the short pass range?
Dump Off and Strong Arm do not combine. Dump Off allows you to throw the ball to Quick Pass range.
Strong Arm allows you to reduce the range of any thrown ball, but never below Quick.
As a Quick Pass is always a Quick Pass with Strong Arm, you won't notice any effect. -Chet

Skummy · Post by **Skummy** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 4:49 pm

Hur. I suppose that makes more sense.

Actually, I just thought of something - do Strong Arm and Accurate combine? I seem to remember that you can't use two skills to modify one roll. Does Strong Arm's current status as a trait override this?

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 4:52 pm

Skummy wrote:Hur. I suppose that makes more sense.

Actually, I just thought of something - do Strong Arm and Accurate combine? I seem to remember that you can't use two skills to modify one roll. Does Strong Arm's current status as a trait override this?

They combine no problem. I believe you're thinking of 4e, but even then they combined because one was a skill and one was a trait.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 7:32 pm

I think the ruling is you can't combine 2 skill's that modify a dice roll (eg you can't combine Mighty Blow and RSC to break armour) but you can combine skills that affect the same action (eg as above strongarm and accurate) as only one affects the dice roll.

Skummy · Post by **Skummy** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 7:48 pm

I just looked it up. The rule is on pg 34 of the living blood bowl rulebok

"1. You can't add bonuses from two or more skills/traits to modify an Armour or injury roll"

So Mighty Blow and Piling On to break armor together are right out, but throwing the ball with Accurate and Strong Arm still work together.

One unrelated question I had concerned the Kick skill. Can you decide to apply it after you roll the dice like you can with Mighty Blow and Piling on? The rules seem a bit unclear about this because it does not take place during a team turn.

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Fri Oct 18, 2002 10:12 pm

Deathwing wrote:Strong Arm does not allow you to Dump Off to Short Pass range.

Edit: Check the FAQs sticky:

Can a player with Strong Arm effectively dump off up to the short pass range?
Dump Off and Strong Arm do not combine. Dump Off allows you to throw the ball to Quick Pass range.
Strong Arm allows you to reduce the range of any thrown ball, but never below Quick.
As a Quick Pass is always a Quick Pass with Strong Arm, you won't notice any effect. -Chet

A quick pass is always a quick pass but so is a short pass if you have strong arm. What am I missing here? It looks like quick pass range is half the ruler, long becomes short and there is no long bomb anymore.

Not being able to reduce below quick has nothing to do with this. Maybe Dump Off should say something about 1/4 of the range ruler or something.