LRB versus PBBL

sympatico · Post by **sympatico** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:03 pm

Ok, IÂ´m back with another "which version of the rules" question. The thing is, IÂ´ve downloaded and read both the living rulebook and the PBBL and I just canÂ´t make up my mind which rules I should use. I like and dislike things about both versions. So IÂ´m putting it to you, which version do you guys think I should go for? For the record IÂ´m a former bloodbowl player who hasnÂ´t played for many years and am just getting back into the hobby. One last question; is the LRB very different from the rules you get with the current box set or just in minor ways?

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:17 pm

they are both pretty different from each other, and they are both different than what's in your box set.

as for which to use, if that were an easy answer, these forums would be a much less interesting place.

my honest answer is that there is no answer ... there's certainly nothing wrong with taking parts of rules from various sources and making your league your way.

mlindsay2706 · Post by **mlindsay2706** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:19 pm

The LRB is only different to the rulebook in minor ways, but you will want to check them as some team set ups etc.. have been altered slightly.

I'd use PBBL. Its much more in depth, has better teams, and generally,its just so much more fun! great set of rules. Also, the PBBL rulebook will become the offical Bloodbowl rules in June/July of this year.

wesleytj is right though...its your call

Hope i helped

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:20 pm

Simple answer: PBBL. In a couple of months it will be official and then fixed in stone for at least two years (I suspect longer). Hopefully the new boxed set in 2007 will attract some new coaches to your league, and you want them to be able to slot right in.

Besides, PBBL is far superior...

*sets flame-retardant hat to a jaunty angle*

TuernRedvenom · Post by **TuernRedvenom** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:28 pm

Well if you're new to the game then all the "major" changes some of the the veterans are all worked up about are pretty minor really. I'd recommend pbbl but both sets are very good.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:33 pm

Mayor? Of where?

TuernRedvenom · Post by **TuernRedvenom** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:46 pm

Nazgit wrote:Mayor? Of where?

where, what?

sympatico · Post by **sympatico** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 8:24 pm

what do you guys think are some of the major pros/cons of the LRB/PBBL?

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 8:57 pm

The LRB is only different to the rulebook in minor ways, but you will want to check them as some team set ups etc.. have been altered slightly.

I'd use LRB. Its much more in depth, has better teams, and generally,its just so much more fun! Great set of rules. Unfortunately, the PBBL rulebook will become the offical Bloodbowl rules in June/July of this year.

wesleytj is right though...its your call

Hope I helped

(And yes, this is just a direct copy of mlindsay2706's post, but corrected for the right info.)

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 8:59 pm

Simple answer: LRB 4.0. In a couple of months it will unfortunately be unofficial. I doubt the new boxed set in 2007 will attract some new coaches to your league, and so go with the old rules to be able to slot right in.

Besides, LRB is far superior...

*sets flame-retardant hat to a jaunty angle*

(And yes, this is just a editted copy of Nazgit's post, but corrected for the right info.)

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 9:03 pm

And if you're unsure of what my 2 posts are aiming at (not an unusual occurance), basically you're not going to get a black & white answer.

Some people (correctly;)) like LRB 4.0, some like PBBL, some like 3rd edition, some couldn't care less which version they play and some will take what they see as the best parts of all the systems and combine them into one houseruled game.

Me, in a straight fight between LRB 4.0 and PBBL, it's LRB 4.0 by a landslide.
But I'll be using a LRB 4.0 with some rules stolen from PBBL and some houserules in my own league.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 9:22 pm

sympatico wrote:what do you guys think are some of the major pros/cons of the LRB/PBBL?

LRB 4.0

Pro:
More fun in general.
Rewards team building, without trying to make development "evil".
Skills & Traits system.

Cons:
Handicap table is sometimes too good, sometimes to crap.
DP not fixed to +1/+1 (which the conspiracy buffs say was a deliberate ploy to make PBBL seem more palatable).

PBBL

Pro:
TV replaces TR
Team list changes
MNG not counting towards TV.

Cons:
Inducements, and reliance on Stars.
The whole fixed win ratio for underdogs, regardless of TV difference
The skills system, and subsequent nerfing of some skills.

Just off the top of my head.

But of course, you'll find that someone will have the exact opposite pros and cons. It's all subjective, and just what works for you.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 9:56 pm

Darkson wrote:LRB 4.0

Pro:
More fun in general.

C'mon Simon, I don't want to turn this into another "versus" thread, but how about backing up your points?

More fun? How? I'd say secret weapons, special play cards and less walkover games makes PBBL more fun. But I would say that.

How exactly, in your opinion, is LRB more fun?

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Sun Apr 23, 2006 10:13 pm

sympatico wrote:what do you guys think are some of the major pros/cons of the LRB/PBBL?

OK, trying to be as impartial as possible:

LRB 4.0

Pros:
- Familiar to current coaches. Any major change in rules will take time to spread, and may alienate some.
- Years of tweaking make this a stable and balanced system (though how does that explain DP and the handicap table?)

Cons:
- Team Rating does not accurately reflect team "value" A Wardancer with a ST upgrade can be worth 1TR extra, whilst and entire team with no skills can be worth 16TR extra. Also makes you pay for players who are missing the game due to injuries.
- Handicap Table is usually totally pointless, but occasionally way too good (e.g. Virus against a team with lots of niggles).
- Clunky skills and traits system.
- Over-rewards team building, with many games being pointless walkovers. This leads to disenchanted new coaches who soon drop out of the game after being trashed by the local power gamer.
- Difficult to get a new team off the ground if they suffer any injuries early on in their development.
- Certain skills (Claw, DP) are totally broken.

PBBL

Pros:
- Better rulebook layout, with most ambiguities and typos in the LRB corrected.
- Team Value over Team Rating. This accurately reflects the power of a team for a given match.
- Skills only system and new skills. Easier to use, increases choice and does a little bit to tone down the previously overpowered skills. Claw, DP and Stand Firm no longer quasi-broken. Wrestle helps to tone down Block.
- More realistic prices for Big Guys.
- New teams easier to get off the ground.
- Introduction of secret weapons!
- Inducements try to make all games interesting, even for the underdog.

Cons:
- Inducements reward some teams better than others. Khemri are an example of a team that seems to get a lot of value out of them.
- Inducements can sometimes be tailored too well for a particular opponent, giving the underdog a better chance of winning than the overdog. Hopefully some recent changes have sorted this.
- Star Players are unpopular and annyoing.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:21 am

See, told you.