Skilling up a new gobbo team....

[ARoninPhilosopher]

After only two games, I'm fortunate enough to have two gobbos get their first skill. No other gobbos have any SPPs except for the Fanatic who has an MVP.

The first gobbo got a regular skill roll. While I'm leaning heavily towards sidestep, I'm willing to listen to other reasoning!

The second gobbo rolled a 4+6 That really is annoying in that the choices are ALL good: +MA, +AV, or a regular skill! What would the knowledgeable among us suggest?

For completeness, and if it helps otherwise to know, here is the composite of the team:

10x Goblins; 2x Trolls; 1x Pogoer; 1x Bombadier; 1x Looney; 1x Fanatic; 2x Rerolls; 9x FF; 130K waiting to be spent.

All constructive suggestions welcome.

ARP

[DoubleSkulls]

All 4 SWs is probably a bad thing. They will all get sent off, meaning that its easy for your opponent to win the numbers game. Worst of all you can end up having to field them for drives at the end of the 1st half meaning even fewer players for the 2nd half.

With that in mind I'd take the Av just so you've got one who might last a little longer. If you don't want that then the MA.

The money should go on rerolls - I think at least 4 shoul dbe an aim. If you don't have an apoth get one first.

[ARoninPhilosopher]

Was gonna go for the MA (who doesn't have the need for speed?!), then read an article by Uncle Bigbad on using gobbos in various flight (TTM) modes. That convinced me, with your reply, to go with the armor! Now if I can just keep "TripsNfalls" alive long enough to get Jump Up, then we're in business!

p.s.: Mods, I think I got this post on the wrong thread, could you please move it? Thanks.

[Joemanji]

All 4 SWs is probably a bad thing. They will all get sent off, meaning that its easy for your opponent to win the numbers game. Worst of all you can end up having to field them for drives at the end of the 1st half meaning even fewer players for the 2nd half.

...

The money should go on rerolls - I think at least 4 shoul dbe an aim. If you don't have an apoth get one first.

I agree - you need to sack at least one of those SWs ... the bomber first, and the pogoer second.

As for skills; well Side Step is good. I found Diving Tackle to be useful too, and Sure Feet is always welcome.

As Ian said - you need more re-rolls! 4 is a minimum for a Goblin team.

[fen]

imo The trick with Secret Weapons is to lowball your Team Value so you can get 1-2 Bribes a match.

Of course, the Secret Weapon that should be dropped before anything else is the Bomber. I personally wouldn't want cut the Pogoer if I can because he's your best fouler and the only player in the game that starts with DP.

This is how (after experience) I'd start my Goblin team.
2 Troll
8 Goblin
Pogoer
Looney
Fanatic
3 Reroll
3 FF
(900K)
Inducing a Bribe from the outset, plus saving money to buy replacements as needed. Apoth after first match (as long as nothing major is injured, if that happens then I'd retire the team and try again.)

Note: Even with this I'm not happy at having only 3 Rerolls and 3FF. I prefer to play with 1.1Mil teams (which would be +1 Reroll, +4 FF/9th Goblin)

I think (after playing with them) all Secret Weapons should have been switched to have a 7+ ejection roll at the end of a drive (instead of auto ejection) and then had their prices altered further to compensate. But I noticed this too late so the SW heavy Goblin team is somewhat screwed as a result (fun to play though.)

Skill wise:
Goblins: Sidestep, Diving Tackle, Sure Feet, Catch, Sneaky Git.
I like one goblin with Sure Feet, Catch + Sprint for those desperate one turn attempts.
Trolls: Break Tackle, Guard, Piling On (only use it when I have +1 to injury)
Fanatic: Mighty Blow, Guard, Grab
Looney: Dodge, Sidestep
Pogoer: Sneaky Git, Sidestep (beyond that it depends what you use him for)
Bomber: Sidestep (who knows what else, as he only really wants passing skills...)

[Joemanji]

I think (after playing with them) all Secret Weapons should have been switched to have a 7+ ejection roll at the end of a drive (instead of auto ejection) and then had their prices altered further to compensate. But I noticed this too late so the SW heavy Goblin team is somewhat screwed as a result (fun to play though.)

Interesting. Having played with them a lot in the MBBL2, I am happy we have lost random ejection rolls. The rolls themselves can win or lose you a game in the SWs are good enough, and I think SWs should be fun not game breakers.

However, if I was a commish, I might introduce a rule giving Goblin teams a free Bribe for each game.

[fen]

A free bribe each game would probably work also. I was aiming for something that didn't require a huge list of different rolls for secret weapons while also not resulting in an auto ejection.

My thinking was, the SW Star players can easily be tweaked in price to accomidate the fact that they 'only' get ejected 58.33% of the time.
The goblin team SWs wouldn't really be an issue, each one of them is pretty much balanced in itself (Random movement for B&C, can't move and throw for bombs, effective AV4 (without dodge) and slow development for Looney and the Pogoer simply has unusual skills.)
It's the Dwarf Deathroller that gives me pause for thought, as it normally gets a 7 - 8 turn drive anyway, this might result in it being able to stay on pitch for 10+ turns. Mind you, if it cost more like 200K then that might balance it.

Still, the free bribe is a simpler method, I know I have to sack the bomber from my Goblin team atm as I seem to end the first half with less than 10 players anyway.

[Joemanji]

My thinking was, the SW Star players can easily be tweaked in price to accomidate the fact that they 'only' get ejected 58.33% of the time.

That is kinda my point. You build a SW around it only being on the pitch an average of 3.4 drives (the average for that ejection rate). However, some games the SW will play 1 drive and other games it will play 8 or 9. This way the SW ejection rolls become too important IMO.

I know I have to sack the bomber from my Goblin team atm as I seem to end the first half with less than 10 players anyway.

Bomber is pretty risky anyway. Fumbles and inaccurate throws can cause more damage to your precious AV7 gobbos than to the opposition, and of cause a turnover...

[fen]

It'll be a shame to let Crazy Harry go.

But tbh, if I want bombs for a game, Bomber Dribblesnot is the way forward.

I should have pushed hard for Bombers to get Passing Access on normal rolls. With them only skilling up with CAS (for all the blocking they do) and MVPs I doubt they would have become obscene. But it's too late now.

Enough Off Topic deviation though.

[ARoninPhilosopher]

I agree that the numbers game gets rough. Last game I was down to 4 players right before the half (hot dice got all but one back) and having to field SW as replacement exacerbated that. A greedy Chaos player could've led the game at that point but insisted on beating up my gobbos and was reaching for his ball runner when time ran out!

Goblins are truly quirky fun, and the SW add to that. Nevertheless, I just assign them solo defense/offense roles. The bomber (Gozeboom) has dropped his load twice in his own/adjacent square, but has knocked down a chaos warrior; Leepz'n'Bowndz (pogoer) almost scored a touchdown on offense but I used an ill-advised gfi and he fell... skull-skull ; GeeAH'U (fanatic) is a hoot and I can't wait till he gets another SPP to skill up and get Mighty Blow (I use him on the line with the two trolls); so far Blrrblrak (chainsaw) has just been a target, but his dice rolls should be evening out soon (I hope!)

I'm gonna back the aerial assault of Uncle BigBad and give the one Gobbo (SirSlipNslide) Jump Up, and the other (TripsNfalls) AV8. I'll leave them back with the Trolls and have a backup should things fall apart on the other end....

The secret to Gobbos seems to be in the Bugs Bunny Wisdom: "Keep Smiling Doc'!"

[jware30]

I just finished a season with the goblins, under LRB4. I did not have opportunity to use the bomber, but found the fanatic completely worthless. His biggest weakness, lack of a tackle zone. A good player will simply ignore him, and let him die in his own sweet time.

I found break tackle to be key on my trolls, and found none of the standard goblin skills to be particularly rewarding. Debated/thought and planned for the various doubles I might get on my gobos, and got none the whole 8 game season.

Kinda bummed out after playing with the goblins, because things start out bad and get worse. Initially when no one has block your goblins almost have blodge. As teams improve and other players pick up block, your surviving goblins pick up skills like diving tackle, sure feet and side step. And while these are excellent third, fourth picks for some players, they suck as first picks for gobos. So, the team lacks that crucial reward of being able to build something effective.

The league was fun, and we introduced a number of new players to the game.

[Joemanji]

This thread is regarding a PBBL team, so the secret weapon rules are totally different. Here, the fanatic is excellent.

[shagga]

Not playing the PBBL rules but I find diving tackle then sidestep the best way to go on my gobbo teams. Diving tackle means if you get 1 or more on the ball carrier they dare not move without blitzing you off them first, if you get sidestep after then it allows you to nullify some of the blitzes working when they don't knock you down.

Only time I take sidestep first is on my gobbos I gave skill or stat increases too. On the reroll front, 4 is a minimum in my opinion, 3 is ok to start with but you have to really hold back on risky plays for the first 4 turns of a half.

[fen]

Hey Naz, What do you think about house ruling in the abiltity for the Goblin team to purchase Bribes as a permanent part of their Roster?

Should I go with 0-1 or more. And how much should I make them cost?

[Darkson]

Much perfer the Ejection roll to the "one-drive" PBBL rules, basically because they're more fun and "chaotic" (and tes it's both won me and lost me games, a risk I knowingly took).

Allowing Gobbos to have a Bribe "on roster" is an interesting idea though. Part of the reason I stopped playing gobbos in the MBBL was because I couldn't field the fun SW players as much as I'd like.