Big Guy advice

arv9673 · Post by **arv9673** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 3:09 pm

I hate BGs! It has always irked me that I have to take a chance to even move one of my players. Often, when the game is one the line, they fail their roll and the big towering presence turns into a gaping hole in the line. On the other hand, they are nice for plugging up the line of scrimmage and putting against the OTHER BGs. I guess my question is this: Should I just accept the fact that they might fail and save up for one? Or screw it, develop some smaller bad dudes to withstand the onslaught, and get on with my life?
(side note: My FTF league doesn't allow BGs or stunty races, so online is the only place I face them)

DDogwood · Post by **DDogwood** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 9:19 pm

Big Guys have their place, but they are all basically blockers. I would say that it can be handy to have a Big Guy on the team, especially if you need the hitting power, but he should never be central to your strategy.

pelle · Post by **pelle** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 10:01 pm

Just use the BG as an attention drawer, when your BG gets hit, the rest of your team remains safe.
When you are not planning do do anything important with your big guy, just leave it where it is, because if you fail a dice roll, you will indeed have a hole in your line. so always think about the current location of the BG and keep in mind you do noy have to move it...

fen · Post by **fen** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 10:01 pm

DDogwood wrote:Big Guys have their place, but they are all basically blockers..

I disagree with that as the Rat Ogre, Minotaur and (in 5.0) Snow Troll are too fragile to be used as Blockers. They all break almost as often as most linemen do and are better used in a Blitzing/Wide Zone role where their frenzy is a huge threat.

As for the original posters question, imo Big Guys aren't essential to most teams (with exceptions) and it's really a case of picking a big guy if you like big men on your team. Then if you do get one you have to accept the fact that they're going to let you down at times.

If you want reliable big men it's down to the mummies.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 10:13 pm

Under LRB 5.0 the idea is that a team with a BG has no advantage compared to a team with the same TV but no BG, so then it just comes down to wheter you like BG's or not.

shagga · Post by **shagga** » Sun Jul 23, 2006 11:40 pm

As everyone has already said, BG's are great to draw attention or in my orc teams case they are used to tie up my opponent BG so I can roll my cage past them. Once a big guy gets block and guard they actually become useful but up till that point they can cause you trouble. My troll often sat on the bench for my orcs until he got block because I didn't use him well and saw him as too much of a liabilty on offence (I couldn't afford losing the extra player from my cage). BG's are at their best on defense to stop a drive and force the opposition to turn the corner.

I guess to answer your query only get a big guy if you are prepared to rely on a player for nothing other than a 9 square annoyance for your opponent.

Kragz89 · Post by **Kragz89** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 12:56 am

Big Guys in our league are quite dangerous if you get lucky. We have a house rule that if you roll doubles on a big guy you can remove a negative trait. So a few of them have lost Really Stupid and wild animal. The meanest of which is probably the goblin team who now has 2 trolls without really stupid. Makes having a BG a lot more interesting. Though as soon as one of them loses the negative trait they become target number 1 in the league.

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 4:04 am

Kragz89 wrote:Though as soon as one of them loses the negative trait they become target number 1 in the league.

Doesn't that make you think that the house rule is a bit too good?

browwnrob · Post by **browwnrob** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 6:46 am

Darkson wrote:Under LRB 5.0 the idea is that a team with a BG has no advantage compared to a team with the same TV but no BG, so then it just comes down to wheter you like BG's or not.

I dont know, I still think I like the S5 Guard roadblock, very useful if your up against Ogres, especially as my Nurgle Beast rolled +AV

JumpingElf · Post by **JumpingElf** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 7:31 am

I'm playing Woodelfs now for years and I love BGs, even if they take roots.

Ok ... BGs belong to the game and with their traits they count as normal players, so if you hate them, don't play with them in your team. Life could be so easy ...

Fronko · Post by **Fronko** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 7:42 am

To sum it up, every team except stunties can operate without the big guy, trading a little punch/attrition value for a little more reliability. In the end it comes down to the coach preferring them or not over normal players.

stormmaster1 · Post by **stormmaster1** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 10:09 am

On one of my orc teams the troll cost me a few wins to skill up, as i blocked with him a lot more than was necessary to try and skill him up. it was worth it though as his second skill was a double, and he quickly became a star in the team. Using the troll so much was a risk, but its just like when elf teams pass in the backfield for cheap spps, or handoff close to the EZ to skill up their 3spp wardancer. The thing i like about big guys is in the fluff you get stories about unstoppable rampaging ogres and trolls, yet these never appear in games as everyone is scared to lead the charge with a troll. I find it fun to use the troll more, just accepting the fact it can and will mess up, so accept it and if possible have a back up plan.

DDogwood · Post by **DDogwood** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 2:15 pm

fen wrote:
DDogwood wrote:Big Guys have their place, but they are all basically blockers..
I disagree with that as the Rat Ogre, Minotaur and (in 5.0) Snow Troll are too fragile to be used as Blockers. They all break almost as often as most linemen do and are better used in a Blitzing/Wide Zone role where their frenzy is a huge threat.

I see your point, but these Big Guys make up for their average Armor with their high Strength scores. Their job is to tie up the opponent (and most Big Guys can tie up 2 or 3 opponents at a time) and act as a big target. I find that Blitzing with them is too risky - I need to rely on my Blitz actually accomplishing something. Also, Frenzying Big Guys who end up in the wide zones have a nasty tendency to get pushed off the pitch.

kano · Post by **kano** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 4:43 pm

Actually, I have an orc team and I blitz with my troll quite a bit, now with the loner rule you at least have a chance at a reroll.......Plus for his first skill I gave him Juggernaut so at least that is like having block on offense.......

fen · Post by **fen** » Mon Jul 24, 2006 5:20 pm

DDogwood wrote:I see your point, but these Big Guys make up for their average Armor with their high Strength scores. Their job is to tie up the opponent (and most Big Guys can tie up 2 or 3 opponents at a time) and act as a big target. I find that Blitzing with them is too risky - I need to rely on my Blitz actually accomplishing something. Also, Frenzying Big Guys who end up in the wide zones have a nasty tendency to get pushed off the pitch.

I find if you leave one of them near 2-3 players then he will get blocked, knocked down, fouled and thanks to that AV8 he stands a good chance of being stunned or worse.

I prefer not to blitz with them either, but I certainly do not use them against multiple players. I tend to use them in the thick of things with my other players in support. Which is often rolling up a wide zone and grabbing chain crowd pushes as I go.

As for the wide zones in general, well if your frenzy big guys are getting pushed off, you've either not skilled them up correctly (Stand Firm) or your not giving them the support they deserve. A frenzy big guy who's not threatening at least one flank is a waste of time imo. They don't need to actually go push players, but the threat of it is often enough to help control that area.