Somebody Help Tackle Skill !!

[Holy G]

I have just been abused over on the pitch, As I understand the tackle skill means that when my player tries to dodge - then he cannot use the dodge skill, this is not a problem but the player in question has not declared that he will use the tackle skill until after Ive said I will use the Dodge skill....then because I have declared I will use Dodge he wont then allow me to re-roll...saying I should be aware of his tackle. I was under the impression that if his player is going to use the tackle skill he must declare it before !!! What is everybodies opinion ....as this foolishly cost me three turn turnovers...just some guidance would be a help as I beleive this is a little bit of a dirty tactic.

[martynq]

He is wrong. The only reason you can't use a team re-roll after you've used the Dodge skill is that you can't re-roll the same dice roll more than once. His reason for saying you can't use a team re-roll is therefore wrong... it's not the use of Dodge that prevents the use of a team re-roll, it's the fact that you have re-rolled a roll at all. If you are prevented from using Dodge by Tackle, you can still use a team re-roll because the dice roll has not yet been re-rolled.

Hope that helps!

Cheers,
Martyn

[Holy G]

Im not sure if he let me roll first, and then declared his use of tackle, how would that stand ? Because surely he has to declare use of tackle before I have used a dodge skill and role....or can he declare after the fact ? I understood you cannot use a skill to effect an earlier action ?

Does he have to declare tackle to use it like any other skill ? If so he should surely do this when I make the fist Dodge ?

[martynq]

It all depends how Rules Lawyery you are going to be about it.

The bottom line as I see it is that Tackle cannot prevent you using a team re-roll, it only prevents you using the Dodge skill.

Martyn

[Holy G]

He was purposelly not declaring use of tackle until after I have used the dodge skill, then taking my man down and turn turnover... I think it was just plain skullduggery !!

Can anyone else lend an opinion ..

[Piepgrass]

The answer is pretty straight forward.

If the player you are trying to dodge away from has tackle you simply cant use your dodge skill to reroll a failed dodge. You have to use a TRR if you want to reroll it.
There is no need for him to declare: I use my tackle skill, since its simply negates the dodge skill in every aspect. (dodging and blocking)

Poul

[franck_le_grand]

As piepgrass wrote: he don't have to declare he's going to use tackle. You just can't use dodge at all. Use a TRR to reroll a failed dodge in this situation

[martynq]

I think Poul and Franck are missing HolyG's point. His opponent is saying that because HolyG has said he wants to use the Dodge skill, he can't then use a team re-roll instead. As HolyG suggests, this is pure skullduggery!

Cheers,
Martyn

[Xynok]

He is absolutely wrong.

Consider the rules from p.15 of LRB:

Many players have skills such as catch, pass etc. Unless
stated otherwise in the skill description you never have
to use a skill just because the player’s got it, and you can
choose to use a skill that affects a dice roll after rolling
the dice. For example, you could say you were going to
use the Catch skill either before or after making a Catch
dice roll.

Some skills are also used in the opponent’s team turn. In
this case you may choose to use the skill after an
opposing player carries out an action or moves a
square. If both coaches want to use a skill to affect the
same action or move, then the coach whose team turn
is taking place must use his skill first.

Pay specific attention to that last part. Here is the scenario you describe, and the way it would play out according to the rules:

Coach 1 chooses to dodge with a Player A. The Coach moves Player A, and this movement requires a Dodge roll. After noting the modifiers and determining the roll needed, the die is rolled. Unfortunately, the roll failed. However, Player A has the Dodge skill.

Coach 1 now announces he is going to use the skill to reroll the result. As per the rules, he MUST use his skill first. As he picks up the die, Coach 2 indicates the Player (B) his Player A is Dodging away from has the skill Tackle, and Player B is choosing to use it. Therefore, Player A's Dodge skill cannot be used.

Coach 1 now indicates he has a Team Reroll, he has not used one this turn, and the failed Dodge roll has not been rerolled by any other means. Therefore, Coach 1 is now allowed to use his Team Reroll as normal, and there is nothing Coach 2 can do about it.

Hopefully, Coach 1 meets with success on the Reroll.

You can only use ONE Team Reroll per turn.
You can only reroll the result of any roll ONCE.

If the failed roll falls under these two criteria, you can use a TRR. Period.

He is absolutely wrong.

EDIT:
Technically, you DO indeed have to declare if you are using ANY skill. While most people consider skills like Tackle as a given (ie you can't use Dodge), it IS legal to declare your Player chooses NOT to use Tackle and allow the Dodging Player to use his Dodge skill in order to reroll a failed result. I'm not sure why you would do that, but it IS legal. Why this person feels a Team RR cannot be used because Tackle negates Dodge is beyond me. He is completely, 150%, irrefutably wrong wrong wrong.

EDIT (Part 2):
If he was allowing to use your Dodge skill (ie you actually rerolled the die), then he is simply out of luck. The only way you could use the skill is if he chooses to NOT use Tackle. Once you actually reroll (ie USE the skill), there is nothing he can do about it; he chose NOT to use Tackle. His argument is not only wrong, but completely illogical as well; you can't let them use the skill and THEN decide not to let them use it! Think people!

[Darkson]

HolyG, if I've mis-understood then I apologise, but if your opponent is saying he's using tackle after you've rolled the DODGE re-roll then that's tough, he should have said he was using tackle before you rolled the dice.
Of course, that doesn't mean you can roll the dice so fast he can't get to say "Tackle" but if you say "Dodge failed, using dodge re-roll" and he doesn't say anything then he cannot use tackle to stop you from using it.

At least that's the way I (and our league) played it.

[Xynok]

You should ALWAYS give your opponent the opprotunity to announce their skills, but even if you WERE playing like a jerk and rerolling dice before giving them the chance, you simply remove one of your Team RRs and be done with it.

Likewise, if you start to reroll and they simply sit there and watch you, it is THEIR fault...too bad, so sad...it is their responsibilty to use their skills.

As adults, you should be able to reason with each other, and this is exactly why most people play Tackle negates Dodge, so this is never an issue...unless the Tackle Coach decides to LET you use Dodge, which is perfectly legal. In other words, Tackle is ALWAYS on unless I say otherwise.

In the case you seem to be describing, where you ALREADY rerolled, simply let that roll stand and remove one of your Team RRs. You shouldn't get to reroll the die AGAIN, however. End of discussion.

[longfang]

You've been "dicked" by un unsporting wankle! Go round and Bat the bastard!

[Deathwing]

You've been "dicked" by un unsporting wankle! Go round and Bat the bastard!

Bad day at work dude?

[Darkson]

You've been "dicked" by un unsporting wankle! Go round and Bat the bastard!

Or you can describe as here. Short, succint and to the point

[Dribble Snot]

I think this could have been costly to your game plan and the loss of three team turnovers ridiculous and not how somebody should be playing the game. At the end of the day we are all playing blood bowl for its enjoyment factor not to go out and beat the opponent with really dirty tactics which are outside of the game.

YOU MY FRIEND HAVE BEEN CHEATED