Pass Block vs Dump Off

manusate · Post by **manusate** » Tue Nov 12, 2002 10:22 am

How does this work? Can you use Pass Block on a Dump Off pass?

You know, you blitz the ballcarrier, then he dumps the ball off... and you happen to have a Passblocker around.

Can you use it?

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Tue Nov 12, 2002 10:39 am

A nice big thread on the subject here.

IMO, you can and its a valid anti-dump off tactic as your opponent does not have to dump off so it is his decision whether or not to allow you to make a 2nd move in your turn.

Xynok · Post by **Xynok** » Tue Nov 12, 2002 2:59 pm

After reading the thread in your link, my question is CAN you intercept a Dump Off if you are already in position to do so? If so, and I see no reason why you couldn't, Pass Block does indeed work.

Again, as in my Stand Firm thread, it becomes a debate about the use of technical terms. Specifically here, what defines a Pass vs. a Pass ACTION, or are they the same?

I know I'm perhaps hoping against hope, but they really need to go back through the rules (especially skill descriptions) and concentrate on using consistent verbage, as well as clarifying rules that seem ambiguous (ie if Skill X works when Y happens for any reason, it needs to indicate this.)

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Tue Nov 12, 2002 3:12 pm

I agree about the rules needing a rewrite.

What they really ought to do is rewrite the rules from scratch. Throw away their current separation of "basic" vs "advanced" rules and have one consistent framework.

Half the problems occur because the earlier sections cannot mention advanced rules - so there are no clarifications.

The other half because they've added new layers rules on top of the original without a thorough reworking of all the sections to keep some consistency.

Munkey · Post by **Munkey** » Tue Nov 12, 2002 5:57 pm

ianwilliams said:

What they really ought to do is rewrite the rules from scratch. Throw away their current separation of "basic" vs "advanced" rules and have one consistent framework.

I couldn't agree more, I have been saying this since Deathzone was released.

IMO the game was designed to be played in a league format and should be played with all the rules as i'm sure everyone here would agree.

The split in the rulebook seems to have come about as a result of the original (3rd edition) game being sold in two parts (Blood Bowl and Deathzone) and a desire to ease new players into the game with the basic rules.

The current ruleset has gone beyond any need for this now, if indeed there was any need for it in the first place.

Can anyone imagine playing the game for any length of time without using the 'advanced' rules for creating a team or assisting a block for example

Phew! Rant over

gallowin · Post by **gallowin** » Fri Nov 22, 2002 3:37 am

Xynok wrote:Specifically here, what defines a Pass vs. a Pass ACTION, or are they the same?

A Pass Action would be any movement by a player that ends with a Pass of some sort. Since Dump off isn't done during your turn it's not a Pass Action but just a Pass.

Xynok · Post by **Xynok** » Fri Nov 22, 2002 7:08 pm

I still have the same question: can you intercept a Dump Off if you are already in position?

Answer this, and you answer the Pass Block question. If you CAN intercept a Dump Off, then then you CAN use Pass Block on a Dump Off.

Ithilkir · Post by **Ithilkir** » Fri Nov 22, 2002 7:17 pm

In my opinion (and only mine). I'd say a player already in position to could intercept the ball ("the normal throwing rules apply"). Plus if you take American Football or rugby, you can and will see dump offs intercepted by the opposition team.

Pass Block.. ermm.. pass (no pun intended). Part of me says no, the pass would be too quick to respond to by moving towards it, the other half of me says "Yup, it's treated as a normal pass and can be pass blocked". Each to his own mind you

Post by **Thadrin** » Sat Nov 23, 2002 9:25 am

I have a feeling this contradicts the ruling the BBRC have given out, but the LRB says:

"A player with this skill is allowed to move three squares when the opposing coach announces one of his players is going to pass the ball." (p.36, v1.3)

Note there is no mention of a pass ACTION being declared. The dump off is to all intents and purposes a pass, so I see no reason why Pass Block shouldn't be allowed, or interceptions by players in a position to do so making attempts.

In American Football, when playing the option (the obvious parallell of the Dump Off skill) only a moronic QB would attempt to pitch the ball to his Tailback with a Linebacker stood right in the way, or a cornerback ready to pounce, and if he does then he can take the consequences.

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Sat Nov 23, 2002 10:18 am

All league commissioners definately should declare whether pass block only can be used in the opponent's turn or not.

Btw, In my oppinion Jump Up cannot be used with pass block in the opponent's turn, since jump up is used in the beginning of the models turn and thats in your own team turn.