Turn overs and Touchdowns

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:28 am

Why do you need Galak? He's wrong on lots of things. There are obviously people very in tune with the rules right here. Maybe you'll get lucky and he'll stay out so you can decide what the actual rules say instead of trying to make them fit what Tom pops in and says which may or may not be right.

Now carry on. You're doing great.

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:01 pm

I think Galak is wrong on this one. The opponent's turn only starts once the ball has come to rest - so its a TD in your turn. Anything else is just plain daft IMO.

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:02 pm

Oh - and if you insist on it being in the opponent's turn then you are implicitly saying that if this happens in T16 and your opponent has already had their T16 then there is no TD? That is crazy IMO.

Xeterog · Post by **Xeterog** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 2:32 pm

This should be a TD in the Reaver's Turn...not in the opposing turn. The ball must come to a rest before the turn ends and the the opponents turn begins.

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:45 pm

Mad Jackal wrote:Galak.
That can't be true. Did one of us read the scenario incorrectly ?

Sorry ... I misread. I thought an opponent caught the ball from the bounce from the question. My bad ... very sorry guys.

I agree with Ian ... needs to be a TD in the Reaver's turn.

Galak

Jural · Post by **Jural** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:32 pm

So are the rules clear on this one? I personally think Darkson's ruling is correct and clear, so no need to modify the rulebook...

Azoth · Post by **Azoth** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 6:22 pm

Yes, I think we got a final agreement: The TD in the given example happens at the end of the moving teams turn, right after the final outcome of the ball bouncing, thereby forcing a turnover (out of two reasons: TD and failed pick up).

Nevertheless, to make it clearer it could be an option to add to the pick up failure section that the turnover happens immediately AFTER resolution of bouncing ball - if it shall be possible to use team re-rolls on any catch tries, or happens BEFORE resolution of the bouncing ball, but the bounce of ball still counts towards the moving teams turn.

Kyrel · Post by **Kyrel** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:32 pm

I didn't read through the entire thread, but IMO the rules are pretty clear on the original scenario.

Player 1 from Team A drops the ball (causing a Turnover once the ball ceases moving) which scatters into the hands of Player 2 from Team B, who incidently is standing in the End Zone.
Player 2 catches the bouncing ball in Team A's turn, and in the process scores a TD as the opponent's turn is ending.
Team B's next turn is spent celebrating the unexpected TD and Team A will move first after the next Kick-Off.

Hope that made sense.

Azoth · Post by **Azoth** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:37 pm

Kyrel wrote:I didn't read through the entire thread, but IMO the rules are pretty clear on the original scenario.

Player 1 from Team A drops the ball (causing a Turnover once the ball ceases moving) which scatters into the hands of Player 2 from Team B, who incidently is standing in the End Zone.
Player 2 catches the bouncing ball in Team A's turn, and in the process scores a TD as the opponent's turn is ending.
Team B's next turn is spent celebrating the unexpected TD and Team A will move first after the next Kick-Off.

Hope that made sense.

In your scenario it makes sence, just in mine it was a player of Team A catching the ball

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 1:23 pm

Yep, so its Team A's turn.

Scenario: Player A1 tries to pick up the ball & fails & its caught by Player A2 in the team B endzone.

Result - Team A score a TD and their turn ends as normal

Scenario: Player A1 tries to pick up the ball & fails & its caught by player B1 in the Team A's endzone

Result - Team B score a TD & move their turn marker forward one.

Everyone happy?

Zoot · Post by **Zoot** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:35 pm

ianwilliams wrote:Yep, so its Team A's turn.

Scenario: Player A1 tries to pick up the ball & fails & its caught by Player A2 in the team B endzone.

Result - Team A score a TD and their turn ends as normal

Scenario: Player A1 tries to pick up the ball & fails & its caught by player B1 in the Team A's endzone

Result - Team B score a TD & move their turn marker forward one.

Everyone happy?

I'd agree with this. I'm sorry, I had misinterpreted the original question in my previous post.

Mad Jackal · Post by **Mad Jackal** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:18 pm

Snew wrote:Why do you need Galak? He's wrong on lots of things. There are obviously people very in tune with the rules right here. Maybe you'll get lucky and he'll stay out so you can decide what the actual rules say instead of trying to make them fit what Tom pops in and says which may or may not be right.

Now carry on. You're doing great.

Simply because not all of the rules are logical and one might suspect that if the Blood Bowl Champion himself answers a rules question then that answer is right and "screw" what the rest of us or logic has to say..

So in my opinion once Galak has made a ruling, then he *should* correct that ruling if he made it in error.

I don't think having two BBRC memebers posting two different answers in the thread helps this chap out with explaining things to his league mates...

But thanks for your support snew.

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:30 pm

Mad Jackal wrote:
Snew wrote:Why do you need Galak? He's wrong on lots of things. There are obviously people very in tune with the rules right here. Maybe you'll get lucky and he'll stay out so you can decide what the actual rules say instead of trying to make them fit what Tom pops in and says which may or may not be right.

Now carry on. You're doing great.
Simply because not all of the rules are logical and one might suspect that if the Blood Bowl Champion himself answers a rules question then that answer is right and "screw" what the rest of us or logic has to say..

So in my opinion once Galak has made a ruling, then he *should* correct that ruling if he made it in error.

I don't think having two BBRC memebers posting two different answers in the thread helps this chap out with explaining things to his league mates...

But thanks for your support snew.

Uughhh. I think I'm going to be sick. You know he's just a guy from the middle America, right? It's for this very reason that I think Tom needs to stay out of this portion of the forum. It's your's and others outright worship of him and your view that everything he says is the final say that scares me, especially since he doens't have time to actually read what's was asked and can spout something off the cuff like he did here.

His Holiness needs to climb a mountain so you have to make a pilgrimage to ask questions directly of him. Anything else and you're running with scissors.

Have a nice day. May all your rolls be 6s.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 7:49 pm

I don't think Galak's the Blood Bowl (Rules) Champion anymore anyway - that position finished when LRB5 became official. Now he's just one of five(?) BBRC members.

No offence Tom.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:16 pm

*Sigh*, no one is more or less holy than anyone else... and all are quite human... and capable of mis-reads and (correctable) errors....

Anyone on the BBRC have at least as intimate knowledge of the rules and system as anyone else... therefore they have a certain amount of perceived respect for that knowledge.... Tom Anders, aka Galak Starscraper, was hands-on for the BBRC AND organizing and final proofing the rules before release (a nod to any others that I may not know about)... his self-less devotion to the game no doubt garners him extra perceived respectability.... Ditto his promotion of the game through additional miniatures, etc., efforts....

Soooooooo... it's not unreasonable to think that Galak "ought to know" what he is talking about.... He's still human, as we all are, and misread the example... was respectfully advised, briefly debated(?), and a consensus reached.... Ain't that the way it's supposed to be?