First skill double on a Beastman

Storch · Post by **Storch** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 6:38 am

Ok, so I am working on my Chaos team and things are going pretty well so far. This is what I have to date:

Mino w/Claws
2x CW w/Dodge
2x CW w/Block
2x BM w/Guard
BM w/Block
BM w/Block, Mighty Blow.-AV

Now heres my question, I just rolled the first skill on a beastman and rolled a double.

I am currently thinking Pass as it would allow me to build a passing game with strong arm and, if I'm lucky another double down the road for something like accurate. Hail Mary is also being contemplated, though I think pass would be better.

On the other hand, I could just ignore the double and go for something more mundane like ball handling skills and keep my team value down a bit.

What do people think, should I go Pass or is there something spectacular I have not even considered?

Thanks.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 10:36 am

Pass is good, though more for the passive threat and last ditch opportunities it offers. Chaos are never going to have a great passing game, so it should be considered plan B. However, just having the option could make your opponent behave differently.

I'd consider Dodge. Chaos can get bogged down easily, and the ability to move around is a godsend.

Cheers
Joe

DamianTheLost · Post by **DamianTheLost** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 1:35 pm

I've played chaos since third edition and the first double/ag upgrade I roll I always use to develop a thrower. Give him pass, followed by sure hands, block, strong arm with eyes on dodge/accurate on a second double. ST/AG upgrades are ace on guy like that. You have a ball carrier that can threaten to throw the long pass or simply run the ball and hand off to another SPP hungry player if needed. If you get any more doubles as first rolls on a beastie, go dodge. That's an ace skill for chaos like jumanji said, but I'd want a thrower first

stashman · Post by **stashman** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:06 pm

Leap!

and then very long legs as next skill.

fen · Post by **fen** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:39 pm

Dodge. Dodge is the best doubles for Chaos. It keeps your players on their feet and saves on rerolls. It also stacks well with Guard and Stand Firm, which are two skills that are fantastic picks (after Block).

Block, Dodge, Guard, Stand Firm is one of the best utility/line Beastmen you can build.

Dodge also opens the door to building a runner type (Block, Sure Hands, +AG/Extra Arms) or even a (hand off) reciever (Block, Dodge, Extra Arms, Catch).

Chaos doesn't need* throwers early on, but it can always use additional dodging guard players, recievers and runners. Dodge is the most powerful and most flexible choice this early on.

*Just to cover any of those people who feel a need start defending the thrower. I'm not saying you shouldn't build a thrower, but that early on a thrower isn't essential to the team. It's becomes a nice option once you have a solid base of skills.

Geoff Watson · Post by **Geoff Watson** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:46 pm

How many rerolls do you have?
You might want Leader.

Also, if you want a thrower I'd take Accurate over Pass; you can use a team RR instead of Pass.

Geoff.

Storch · Post by **Storch** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 9:02 pm

Geoff, Currently I have 3 rerolls and am considering buying a fourth.

I am sitting on 280,000 gp with the team already thanks to a string of spectacular winnings rolls coupled with FAME, so it's really an issue of whether I want to pump up my team value and give away more inducements as I am currently one of the higher Team Values in our league.

Storch · Post by **Storch** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 9:08 pm

After a bit of thought, I realized that, if I wanted useful feedback, I should give you an idea of the league makeup.

Currently we are pretty bashy (a knee-jerk reaction to last season which was dominated by a couple over-developed elf teams which could do anything they wanted if they could roll a 2 with a built in reroll). The league looks like this:

2x Dwarves (one has an unbelievable passing game that shouldn't work, but does)
2x Lizardmen
2x Orcs
Vamps
Ogres
Nurgle

and, of course, my Chaos.

prisma · Post by **prisma** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:30 pm

I'd take jump-up and develop the player with mblow and piling-on.
Later claws, if he makes it to a fourth skill.
You still lack a really mean destructive basher on your team...

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:43 am

I've found Jump Up to be sub-optimal to say the least, and I've taken it on a lot of players (including a Dodge+Stand Firm orc blitzer). Never seems to come into play.

tenwit · Post by **tenwit** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:47 am

Joemanji wrote:I've found Jump Up to be sub-optimal to say the least, and I've taken it on a lot of players (including a Dodge+Stand Firm orc blitzer). Never seems to come into play.

Do you mean for the "free" block thing? I agree. But the +3MA part of it happens all the time for me (well.. twice a game, or so). It's a firm favourite on my human catchers and skinks, and a popular doubles skill on my blitzers and sauruses. There's a lot of skills that pop up less often than that..

Storch · Post by **Storch** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 4:29 am

First off, thanks to everyone for their input.

I have been doing some thinking and may have struck on a neat twist here. I could take Dodge and plan on Extra Arms, Big Hand and maybe Two Heads down the road to make him the guy who can get into a cage, pick up the ball and dodge out.

It may sound situational, but a lot of players in my league are content to leave the ball with 3 or so tackle zones on it and pick it up next turn and this build would really put a wrench in that plan.

Thought?

bouf · Post by **bouf** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 5:08 am

Take Leap then VLL then Big Hand...

Leap in, snag the ball, Blitz out.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:20 pm

Dodge over Leap. Leap/VLL/BH is a great combination, but you don't want to be sitting around waiting to earn 10 SPP before you can use your skill. Then go Extra Arms or Big Hand, then either the other one or Two Heads. If you're looking for a combo for VLL, play Skaven. Too skill-intensive for AG3 to make it happen. Too bad Elves can't mutate!

Other contenders: Pass, Side Step. Pass is huge: a team RR is fine if you have one skill of the three (SH, Pass, Catch), but if you need three rolls, a re-roll skill to take pressure off the TRR makes a big difference. Side Step helps you keep the ball on your opponent's side like no other skill does, and that's the key to victory with Chaos (short fields, that is, not Side Step).

bouf · Post by **bouf** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:41 pm

mattgslater wrote:Dodge over Leap. Leap/VLL/BH is a great combination, but you don't want to be sitting around waiting to earn 10 SPP before you can use your skill. If you're looking for a combo for VLL, play Skaven. Too skill-intensive for AG3 to make it happen.

4+ isn't as bad as you might think... and given that his opponents tend to swarm the ball on the ground, I think that it's a good way to go. Besides, he has 2 CWs with dodge... My bet is they'd be better suited to the Two heads/Extra Arms road. (If they fail the pick up... They're CWs for corns sake! They love being in the middle of 3 lads punching it up)

After Leap, VLL, BH, I'd look at Juggernaught and Frenzy. Maybe Block and Pass Block.

But I get a kick out of thinking outside the box with double rolls... I loath taking Dodge or what have you as a "default" double skill choice...