CheerLeaders. How many?

Kr00zA · Post by **Kr00zA** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:44 pm

Did a quick search but didnt find anything.
How many CheerLeaders should one take?
Just want to know what you guyz take and why

stashman · Post by **stashman** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:50 pm

If you have 3 cheerleaders you will probably win most Cheering Fans results.

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:51 pm

Ina tournie, two of each would be the max and often less. It depends on how much money I have left over really.

In a league, can be pretty complicated.
Some coaches base it on how expensive their rerolls are (so an Undead team would buy more).
Some just buy enough to negate other people staff.
Some play reroll denial and ensure they have an over whelming advantage (halfing really).
Some base it on how many models they have.

If you want a mathematical approach I can't help you. Sorry!

cyagen · Post by **cyagen** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 4:57 pm

Actually PubBowler's answer makes sense.

It depends what kind of team you play and the strategy of the other coaches in your league.

Personnally I would try to negate the staff of my opponents but all in all, it makes sense for teams with expensive re-rolls should invest more since a 10k can be worth 7 times more. As for the flings, it seems crucial to load up on staff to deny the RR opportunities. Also, once you got your full roster, there is not much good to do with that money anyway

Kr00zA · Post by **Kr00zA** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 5:08 pm

Thanx.
Well I have an Orc team in the making and my main reason for asking the question is so I know how many cheerleaders I need to model for it.
I realize this is very much a matter of conjecture but I thought if anuf people gave their own personal oppions I could work out an average

Tritex · Post by **Tritex** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 5:08 pm

Never enough Cheerleaders and they really make great party candy

.....Oh your talking about blood bowl

...er 2 is usually good.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 5:50 pm

One more than the other guy.

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:41 pm

mattgslater wrote:One more than the other guy.

True to a point. If the other guy has got 10 say, you are better off with inducements for the same value.

Kr00zA · Post by **Kr00zA** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 1:09 pm

Hmmm... so basicly 2 are good... 3 max... any more and your being a bit silly, which you should still try to avoid even if your opponent is being silly with his for example 10 cheerleaders

Marlow · Post by **Marlow** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 2:13 pm

The Average Team Reroll costs 60 kpg, and twice that to buy an extra one after the team starts.

So if you look at Cheerleaders/Assistant Coaches together you can buy three of each for the cost of an Average Reroll.

Of course there is only a 28% chance per kick off of one of these results coming up; and if there are, say, an average of four kick offs a game that is only one extra Reroll per game (assuming you win). So is it good value for your investment?

Reroll
Cost Teams
40 kgp 1 - Dwarf
50 kgp 7 - Amazons, Dark Elf, Elf, High Elf, human, Wood Elf, Slann
60 kgp 7 - Chaos, Goblin, Halfling, Lizardman, Norse, Orc, Skaven
70 kgp 9 - Chaos Dwarf, Khemri, Necromantic, Nurgle, Ogre, Undead, Vampire, Chaos Pact, Underworld

cyagen · Post by **cyagen** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 4:45 pm

Marlow your calculation is good for a starting team, but once the league is started, C and AC still costs 10k and the RR are now double the price. In that situation they may be worth it.

10k for 1 xtra reroll per game is not that bad...

Marlow · Post by **Marlow** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 5:56 pm

cyagen wrote:Marlow your calculation is good for a starting team, but once the league is started, C and AC still costs 10k and the RR are now double the price.

I know that is why I say "and twice that to buy an extra one after the team starts"

cyagen wrote: In that situation they may be worth it.

That is the question we are all trying to answer!
Does it turn into an arms race of once my team starts buys them everyone else has to just to compete?

Cramy · Post by **Cramy** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:52 pm

To benefit from the ACs/CLs, you need to have as many kick-offs as possible. So for me, as a general rule, if I play a bashy team that doesn't score much, I don't invest in ACs/CLs very much.

If I play Elves, I tend to have a TV that is much higher than my opponents as the positionals are bought later, and Elf players tend to gain more skills. So buying ACs/CLs means giving my opponents more inducements, and having to pay more Spiralling Expenses. So I keep my ACs/CLs low.

For teams that score lots and/or don't know what to spend their money on after a while, and tend to have a less steep TV curve, then ACs/CLs are more worth it. Skaven is an example of this, especially if you play without a Rat Ogre. Then I get more ACs and CLs.

An then you have the Stunties. Their TV stays low and unless your players keep dying (which happens), you should have the money to buy ACs/CLs. Re-roll denial and having more rerolls is a key strategy for Goblins and Halflings (that's how I play them at least), so I start-out my teams with a few ACs and CLs.

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 7:52 pm

Cramy wrote:Re-roll denial and having more rerolls is a key strategy for Goblins and Halflings (that's how I play them at least), so I start-out my teams with a few ACs and CLs.

My biggest goal when playing Flings is re-roll denial to my opponent. So the Master Chef and 3 of each of AC and CL are a key part of my Fling teams. I also try to start with a FF of at least 8 when I create the team.

Galak

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Wed Jan 16, 2008 8:03 pm

It's kinda like gamblin': the payoff is multiplied (iirc) by the odds of winning (in this case getting a reroll out of it)... that's on the surface.... (Then there's the opportunity costs of what you could've bought, or not having one when you need it), instead.... It can get maddeningly complicated....

So, let's see... the worth of being 1 AC/CL up on your opponent should be: 5/36 (0.1389) for either one... or 10/36 (0.278) for being one up on each....

Multiply that times the cost of a reroll and compare it to the price of an AC/CL (one of each for the second number):
@40k= 5555.56 or 11111.11
@50k= 6944.44 or 13888.89
@60k= 8333.33 or 16666.67
@70k= 9722.22 or 19444.44
Doubling costs:
@80k= 11111.11 or 22222.22
@100k= 13888.89 or 27777.78
@120k= 16666.67 or 33333.33
@140k= 19444.44 or 38888.89

Now that's IF you get a reroll out of it (it's worth double/triple/etc., if you get more than 1).... Then there's the odds that your opponent will win the reroll....

If your opponent has +1 fame, AND you are only one of each ahead of him, then multiply the value by 2/3 to get the payoff (you get a reroll by ties or wins)....

Now IF I haven't totally butchered the mathematics of it all, it looks like AC/CL are never worth it at start, but may be worth it after start....

If anyone can add to, or challenge, my figures, please do....