3rd Skill for DE runner.

grampyseer · Post by **grampyseer** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:22 pm

Hi all,

Here he is.

7347 Pass, Dump off, Sure hands.

I've rolled doubles, and the obvious stand out is Strong arm.

I find my DE's play a more close range running game, so I'm not too sure about defaulting to strong arm.

My other considerations were Block, which may keep him standing after the dump off,
Dodge: so he can run the ball better,
NOS: so he can chuck better...but it is already a re rolled 3+ for the quick pass.

Any other ideas?.

As a side bar, Are any of you DE coaches having luck with a 2nd assassin?

Thanks for your input.
Cheers

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 8:58 pm

I'd take Strong Arm - just because having the option of an effective longer passing game improves an important attacking option.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:44 pm

Gonna get to 5 improvements with him someday? Strong Arm... maybe. Not gonna get to 76 SPP? Forget the double and take your choice of Accurate or Nerves of Steel. Probably Accurate. Tastes better than SA (boosts your Dump-Off), and less filling (those doubles skills go right to your TV, you know: better to maintain your Elvish figure). Block and Dodge are ok too -- between them, I'd give this guy Dodge unless there's a lot of Tackle -- but I think if you're going to go down that road you might as well have picked a lino.

Strong Arm is a hard call when you don't have any of the standard Thrower skills to start. Seriously, if the guy had S access, you'd never consider it as a top-3 selection on a DE Runner, and even as a #4 it's pretty marginal compared to the field of alternatives. Heck, even if it didn't exist, how much would a DE Runner miss it, really?

You could make a very convincing argument for Strong Arm on Human/Skaven/Orc Throwers, and maybe even Pro/High/Wood Elf Throwers, Norse/Amazon Throwers, and +AG/Big Hand Beastmen. Dark Elves... the opportunity cost is just too great.

Assassins are a good deal if you have a lot of low-AV threats to consider, especially ones that aren't loaded on MA (they're really really good vs. Amazons or any team that uses Stunties, and more than worthwhile against Norse, Ghouls and other Dark Elves, but they're helpless and hopeless against Orcs w/o Goblins to pick on). I'd always have one by the time I've got 14 players, and if one is really pulling his weight two would be better. That said, in a lot of leagues they're late choices at best.

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:47 pm

Matts got some good points.

So he's at 31 SPPs? It is quite a long way to a 4th skill (20 spps, so most likely 10+ games).

If you have a long term league where he's likely to live that long I just love having the accurate, pass, strong arm thrower - 3+ rerollable bombs is awesome.

Of course he's pretty much a one trick pony so if you have to field him on D too its not a good combo of skills to have to field.

juggler434 · Post by **juggler434** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:30 pm

Personally I would forget the double and take accurate, its more useful and won't increase your team value as much

stashman · Post by **stashman** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:53 pm

Sneaky Runner
Dump-Off [Ordinary Skill]
Pass [Reroll the Dump-Off]
Nerves of Steel [Keeps the Dump-Off to a 2+]
Wrestle [Put down your Blitzning opponent and stop his blitz!]
Fend [Don't let the opponent follow up]
Side Step [Put yourself at a "better" place after being blitzed]

Playing Runner
Dump-Off [Ordinary Skill]
Pass [Reroll the Dump-Off or the Pass]
Accurate [Better Passing chances]
Nerves of Steel [Keeps the Dump-Off to a 2+ and if you have another runner, lets you catch on a 2+]
Block [Stay on your feet]
Dodge [Stay on your feet]

Will try thoose in my DE team, BUT I have a lineman with Accurate and Strong Arm and MA7 with a niggling. If he will live on for a while I will try and make one of the Runners a Nerves of Steel, Catch player.

Cramy · Post by **Cramy** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 1:46 pm

Others have touched on the options. Strong Arm or Accurate. Which one depends on if you think that he'll get other skills. If no, take Accurate for sure. If yes, then you still need to think about it. True, 3+ rerollable long bombs are nice, but how often will it happen? Would another skill be more useful on this guy? Depends on your play style.

I would go for Accurate either way, and get Block/Dodge as his next skills if he gets to there.

For the Assassin, having two of them is rarely useful. Depends on your league though. If there are lots of block/dodge low AV teams, then it can be worth it. But often times a lino is more useful because of his better armor and low cost.

I was in a league with Skaven, Lizards, Amazons and Nurgle, and one Assassin was enough for me. Pretty-much useless against Nurgle, very good against Amazons, and of questionable value against Lizards and Skaven. A couple of Blitzers with Tackle and Witches with Block are way more useful at getting at those Dodge ST2 players.

zephard · Post by **zephard** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 2:03 pm

Different option on what has been spoke so far about the runner.
Do you have 2 runners, they work great in getting to dump off to each other, and include a blitzer in there if you can.

What I mean about that, both runners get Pass and NOS, now they can pass to each other on the dump-off and keep a thrid player close by.

Now you got a real threat.

Or if you want one runner to be a long passer, give the other runner NOS and leap, dodge, work him with a blitzer thats leap, dodge also.

Pass the ball to the leaping runner once he is down field with the blitzer in the short pass range of the leaping runner also. Now you have a real threat. Remember with the DEs every can catch the ball, and score, so your opponent has to deep people he got to really guard while your other players are still needing to be covered. Spreads the opponents thin.

As far as 2nd Assassin, kinda makes the amount of players with 7 AV a little much unless you have enough lightly armored teams to play against.
Or if you plan on dropping one after you roll doubles to get that Multiple Stab.

Cramy · Post by **Cramy** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 2:35 pm

zephard wrote:Or if you plan on dropping one after you roll doubles to get that Multiple Stab.

That could be a reason to have two ...

grampyseer · Post by **grampyseer** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 1:53 am

Good ideas all.

Methinks it's down to either accurate, or dodge.....Thanks forthe Strong arm tips..I hadn't considered the TR.

As for the Assassin, my league is mostly bashy.....maybe one is good for now...(he's 12 games in with no spp...i geuss i'd better get cracking

)

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:32 am

In a bashy league, the Assassin is good for holding down the odd dodgy guy. Get him Side Step then DT or Tackle, and make maximum use of the Shadowing.

FischerKing · Post by **FischerKing** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:44 am

Strong arm makes alot of sense. You never know when your thrower need to break out of tight spot and make a good pass.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Tue Feb 26, 2008 1:24 am

A big question: how vulnerable are the most dangerous opponents to Stab and Shadowing? That is, how weak do they look in terms of MA+AV? If the best teams are like Norse, Pro Elves, Amazons, Undead, lino-intensive Wood Elves, etc., then take two Assassins. If they're Orcs, Chaos, Dwarfs, Khemri, CDs, or even Lizards or postional-intensive Woodies, then take only one, and make him a late purchase.