Taking Loner off Big Guys

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:11 pm

Joemanji wrote:Big guys are strong and unreliable.

Only part true. They're terribly unreliable on my team but remarkable brilliant on my opponent's.

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:04 pm

Jural wrote:Longer, more serious answer: In the early PBBL process, the idea of having Big Men count as 2 players was kicked around. The Big Men all gained Multiple Block for free and dropped loner. I THINK they also got General Access.

I think it worked quite well, but I believe others weren't so enthusiastic. I'm often in the minority with stuff like this!

This would be interesing if big guys counted as 2 players in all respects. So for # of players on the pitch, in widezones on setup and even on the LoS. Also for assisting blocks and tackle zones. So a player with an Ogre assist would get +2 ST on a block, and a player attempting to pick up the ball in an Ogre's TZ would suffer a -2 penalty.

Make them really fearsome!

But with the obviously big penalty that you can only field 10 players.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 3:49 am

Joemanji wrote:This would be interesing if big guys counted as 2 players in all respects. So for # of players on the pitch, in widezones on setup and even on the LoS. Also for assisting blocks and tackle zones. So a player with an Ogre assist would get +2 ST on a block, and a player attempting to pick up the ball in an Ogre's TZ would suffer a -2 penalty.

Make them really fearsome! But with the obviously big penalty that you can only field 10 players.

That would make a really great ability for a Giant (two squares wide of course).

coma · Post by **coma** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:55 pm

I dont remember if it was any more changes when the big guys got a lot more expensive but big guy became loner. I dont think thats worth 20K in the ogre example (earlier 120K now 140K). So why just not take away loner and leave it at that.

Another thing we discussed in my league ( loudly i might add) is how to get ex. bone-head away. My firm belief is instead of +1 STR (+50K) you could choose to take away ex. bone-head. It should be a double and the big guy would be much inproved so it must be a hard double ( in this case double 6´s) and the cost would be large too. Still worth it I think, but hard to get and here is the point... you can get it.

stashman · Post by **stashman** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 4:03 pm

coma wrote: Another thing we discussed in my league ( loudly i might add) is how to get ex. bone-head away.

That would be TOO GOOD!!! Bone-head is really needed or the ogre would be damn good. Think of a snotling team with none boneheaded ogres and no loner! Damn!

Take away loner would be a nice thing, nothing more.

Get PRO on the big guy to have a chance of rerolling bonehead etc.

Aliboon · Post by **Aliboon** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:03 pm

I think he was just saying to get rid of bonehead on a double 6 roll-wouldn't happen very often and you'd be giving up a ST6 (or block) ogre to do it.

coma · Post by **coma** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:54 pm

Aliboon: Yepp thats what I ment.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:55 am

OK, here's what I'm doing:

1) Loner no longer exists, and is replaced by the rule: "players who are not permanently included on the team roster may not use Team Re-Roll counters." This improves Big Guys significantly.

2) Big Guys are removed from team rosters and included in an "options" list, often with quality competition in the form of 3rd-ed style star players, secret weapons and extra positionals. Now, many teams that can take a Big Guy wouldn't.

3) Anti-Skills (except Anti-Mutations like Stunty, Titchy and No Hands) can be bought off with a doubles roll. If Really Stupid or Wild Animal is bought off, the player gains Bonehead. Players with M access (regular or doubles) can buy off Anti-Mutations on a natural 12.

4) Big Guys cost an additional 10k.

5) Mighty Blow adds +1 to both rolls, like in 3rd. It only works on a block, like in LRB5.

Aliboon · Post by **Aliboon** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:50 pm

Players with M access (regular or doubles) can buy off Anti-Mutations on a natural 12.

What is the justification for this? The Beast of Nurgle is the only "good" M access big guy I reckon. The Rogre and Mino are WAs and have low AV, so are pretty poor all told.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 9:24 pm

It should be irrelevant, but it's really intended for UWP teams, to allow them to nix Stunty on a particular player. It does help Nurgle even more, but really now, it's so unlikely as to be irrelevant.

About ROs and Minos being underpowered... should maybe I do something about TTM (like make it a skill but require >2x ST of RS player and Mighty Blow to use, and stick it on Stunty team BGs for free), and undo the 10k price increase. If I do that, can I also ditch Always Hungry? The objective is to make BGs a good deal in a vacuum, but then to put comparable temptations up for teams to select from.