"Best" Elven Thrower

stashman · Post by **stashman** » Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:31 pm

Wich elf is the best thrower for their teams? Here are they all with 3 skills.

Develop Elven Throwers

Dark Elf Runner 80K/140K
7 3 4 7 Dump-Off, Pass, Accurate, Nerves of Steel
- Based upon use of Dump-Off and longpassing.

Elf Thrower 70K/130K
6 3 4 7 Pass, Accurate, Kick-Off Return, Safe Throw
- Throw thoose passes to their NOS catchers in tacklezones.

High Elf Thrower 90K/150K
6 3 4 8 Pass, Safe Throw, Accurate, Kick-Off Return, Sure Hands
- A very good thrower. The safe one!

Wood Elf Thrower 90K/150K
7 3 4 7 Pass, Accurate, Block, Dodge
- Wood elfs don't need very long passing games, so based a bit on running.

How would you develop your throwers for their teams?

fire olli · Post by **fire olli** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:40 am

The one thing that gets me mad is having a wood elf thrower in the back field who is ment to be great with ball skills (AG 4). He then runs over to scoop the ball up after the kick off and yes you guessed it a 1 is rolled.

I would just have to give it sure hands.

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 11:57 am

I'm not an experienced Elf coach (well not since 3rd edition) but I'd have to consider HMP for Wood Elves.

Once it goes down field, there's a pretty good chance you'll be the first one there...

FischerKing · Post by **FischerKing** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:02 pm

Darkelf thrower fits pretty good to their playing style, but I wouldnt develope the woodelf one the way you did. Woodelves has one of the two best teams for a passing game, so why not claim that adventage and play that passing game? A good throwing thrower can help you stall, it can help you save rerolls and it really helps your scoring when you are outnumbered (woodelves tend to be outnumbered alot

) My woodelf throwers allways takes passing skills like: Accurate, sure hands, safe throw, Strong Arm, sure feet, before they will take anything like block and dodge. They dont need the block and dodge and they usually stay with the team untill they age (lrb 4) or is killed because the team is outnumbered so badly that they have to lineup front row in defense.

In some LRB 5 league play, with a fixed schedual and lots of bashy monster teams, I might see your point and build a thrower as a compromise between defense and offense, and give him Accurate, dodge then block or sure hands. But thats the only place really. For NaF tournament play you dont take a thrower, and if you do its because the league format forces you to take leader on a normal skill choice.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:32 pm

With Pro Elves, I tend to specialize both Throwers. They're cheap enough that buying Throwers for Leader, even to start, is actually smart money management (unlike, say, High or Wood Elves, who pay a 20k premium instead of 10k).

Thrower #1 becomes the QB, and ideally gets benched on D. The progression for me is usually SH-Accurate-Safe Throw, with either Strong Arm or one of the above on doubles. 10 becomes +MA, and 11 and 12 are obvious on this guy.

Thrower #2 becomes a safety/halfback, with Leader, Dodge, Block. Doubles gets ignored, 10 becomes +MA, and 11 and 12 are, again, obvious.

I might develop #2 first sometimes, but any +MA or +AG on the first roll makes the guy into #1 (if I already have #1 and roll +MA or +AG first on the other, then I just turn #1 into #2 and it's SH-Leader-Dodge, and MA/AG-SH-Accurate for the other).

Marlow · Post by **Marlow** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:33 pm

FischerKing wrote:For NaF tournament play you dont take a thrower,

Slighty defiation I know, but I am intreaged as to why you would not take a Thrower for a Tournament? I would have thought with the limited number of rerolls Elves can afford the free pass reroll would be useful?

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:37 pm

Marlow wrote:
FischerKing wrote:For NaF tournament play you dont take a thrower,
Slighty defiation I know, but I am intreaged as to why you would not take a Thrower for a Tournament? I would have thought with the limited number of rerolls Elves can afford the free pass reroll would be useful?

I'm sure FischerKing can answer himself (and with more authority) but I'd say i was due to the choice of 90k positionals.

Given the choice between a Catcher & a Thrower in a tournie, the Catcher is going to win.

Two skill rerolls & more utility in more situations.

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:54 pm

I value Sure Hands a lot more than you seem to. It's the first skill I give to every elven thrower...they pick up the ball ALL the time, so anything you can get to reroll that from 1/6 to 1/36 failure rate is a really really good thing. That failed pickup can really screw your team.

FischerKing · Post by **FischerKing** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:11 pm

PubBowler wrote:
Marlow wrote:
FischerKing wrote:For NaF tournament play you dont take a thrower,
Slighty defiation I know, but I am intreaged as to why you would not take a Thrower for a Tournament? I would have thought with the limited number of rerolls Elves can afford the free pass reroll would be useful?
I'm sure FischerKing can answer himself (and with more authority) but I'd say i was due to the choice of 90k positionals.

Given the choice between a Catcher & a Thrower in a tournie, the Catcher is going to win.

Two skill rerolls & more utility in more situations.

Well, that was a pretty good answer anyway!

I would add that mv 9 combined with dodge is really really strong in tournaments like that. With the mobility it gives you, your not only very strong in offense, but have the oppertunity to punish alot of mistakes made by your opponent (or his dice). With 4 catchers you can really move the ball around the field!

On sure hands. I think it totally depends on your league, and how developed your opponents is. If you play teams with kick all the time, catch might be better than sure hands on your thrower, as someone will have to handoff or pass it to him after a well placed kick. In a less developed league I agree that sure hands is very good.

Jural · Post by **Jural** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:48 pm

Sure Hands is a must, by the third advance (I can see taking Dodge and Accurate first.)

The only exception I would say would be the Dark Elves. Put sure Hands on a blitzer or two, and catch on both your runners for maximum annoyance with Dump Off. This allows you to develop early a defense against Strip Ball (the blitzers), and as you develop you can make the ultimate Strip Ball Defense (Pass, NOS, Accurate quick passing to NOS, Catch... A 95% success rate!)

But I think the value of the runner is really a deep passing threat (because your blitzers are better in all ways for running the ball.) I am even be tempted to put Hail Mary Pass on my runner as a second skill (after Pass) because of it.

Hail Mary Pass is all about the threat, not the reality

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 12:24 am

Hail Mary? When you can bomb at 56%? With Accurate instead, you can bomb at 75%, and are only 1/6 to fumble (1/2 to use Pass x 1/3 to fumble on Pass RR).

Sure Hands is very valuable as a first skill for Wood Elves. Re-Rolls on those teams don't look too expensive, but when your lino is AV7 and 70k, everything is expensive. If you don't take a Thrower, take SH on a lino.

Andromidius · Post by **Andromidius** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 12:27 am

Well I've been out of Long Bomb range a few times, so being able to Hail Mary the ball right down the pitch away from your own endzone can be handy when you have a slow bashy team baring down on you.

Limited usage, of course.

~Andromidius

Jural · Post by **Jural** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:38 am

mattgslater wrote:Hail Mary? When you can bomb at 56%? With Accurate instead, you can bomb at 75%, and are only 1/6 to fumble (1/2 to use Pass x 1/3 to fumble on Pass RR).

I'm still considering it (Dark Elves Only), and here's why-

1- No Interceptions.

2- Vastly Reduced Fumbles

3- Third skill up is a long way away for an AV 7 target without Block or Dodge.

4- I can run backwards (or stay deep) and get the throw off.

I'll probably go Accurate, but Hail Mary Pass stands out as a very viable option. But not on any of the other elf teams- unless you are developing your Wood Elf catchers with Diving Catch... although I think it's a waste.

whitetiger · Post by **whitetiger** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:56 am

I almost always take my runner - pass, accurate, dodge.

If I take a second runner - surehands, pass, dodge.

And I never throw farther than Short Pass. On rare, and I mean really rare, occassions, I'll throw a Long pass. I never throw further than that. I almost always find a way to blitz a reciever loose or have a player with NOS downfield. Short passes, ball control and more than one reciever downfield and on opposite sides of the field.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:17 am

My post above didn't take into account the fact that you're talking DE, who don't have that leg-up in the passing game, with no Pass or Catch on the rookie team. In that case, I'd still be hesitant to blow a skill on HMP, but it's at least not as senseless as I had thought.