"Best" Elven Thrower

[bouf]

I'd do the same with Darkies as I did with Zons...

1 to get the ball and Long Pass to the Dumper...

1 to be a dumper...

1st = Kick Off return, Pass, Sure Hands (Accurate)
2nd = Wrestle, NoS, Dodge (Pass, catch maybe)

[Jural]

In that case, I'd still be hesitant to blow a skill on HMP, but it's at least not as senseless as I had thought.

Yeah, that's exactly what I was trying to say. Normally I wouldn't consider it (even with the LRB 3 and 4 Dark Elves) but the new runner makes it worthy of consideration (in the absolute sense.)

[mattgslater]

Like, on the 5th roll, with the one you don't develop into a Thrower. Ok.

[wesleytj]

The only exception I would say would be the Dark Elves. Put sure Hands on a blitzer or two, and catch on both your runners for maximum annoyance with Dump Off. This allows you to develop early a defense against Strip Ball (the blitzers), and as you develop you can make the ultimate Strip Ball Defense (Pass, NOS, Accurate quick passing to NOS, Catch... A 95% success rate!)

All I can say to that is that you and I play Dark Elves VERY differently. And that's not necessarily a bad thing - hey if it works for you, then go with it. I don't put Sure Hands on Blitzers, and I DO put them on Runners.

I don't give Catch to ANY of my Dark Elves, EVER, because the whole point of Dark Elves is that everybody is a catcher and that if you give catch to one, it will make you subconsciously focus on that elf at the exclusion of the others. I like having skill rerolls on every possible skill except catch, and in case of 1's there, I rely on team rerolls, and I also make an extra effort to make the catch roll something that if it fails it won't screw me as bad as, say, the pick up roll.

And I consider it a successful game if my runners NEVER have to use dump off, so needless to say building a strategy around that is not something I'd tend to do. I want that to be the last resort, having an opponent hit a guy with av7, and unlikely to have block.

But I think the value of the runner is really a deep passing threat (because your blitzers are better in all ways for running the ball.) I am even be tempted to put Hail Mary Pass on my runner as a second skill (after Pass) because of it.

I don't ever do deep passes with elves except in moments of pure desperation, crazy turnover plays, etc. So again, I'm not going to build skills or strategy around that either. On my team, the job of the runner is to play deep, pick up the ball, advance it partway upfield, and then pass it (usually quick or short) to another elf who is then going to hopefully score with it a few turns later. On defense, I tend not to field runners unless I'm shorthanded, but if I do, their job is generally to stay out of the way until a turnover is created by another elf, then go get the ball and quick/short pass it to another elf. Then, see above.

I have about an 80% win ratio my way, so I'm pretty happy with it. If your way works for you, then great.

Hail Mary Pass is all about the threat, not the reality

I do understand that sentiment, but I think it makes more sense on a faster team. I think HMP is a good 3rd skill on a Wood Elf thrower, for instance, particularly if you have lots of leapers....wait for opponent to come after you, throw very deep, then outrun opponent to the ball for easy score. Dark elves CAN do that, but not as well because they're not as fast.

[mattgslater]

Ah. I'd never consider HMP on a Woodie Thrower. After SH and Accurate, the guy is worth 130k and has AV7. That means Dodge comes 3rd, and is a pretty good argument to take Block 4th, barring doubles. Kick-Off Return is also good, and situationally can save lives by ensuring that an offense turns over after two turns. Safe Throw, Nerves of Steel and a second instance of Leader probably rank right with, or slightly above, HMP in my book on a Woodie Thrower.

[whitetiger]

I don't think I've ever taken HMP on my Dark Elves. I use a run and gun offense, short passes, lots of hand offs. I also like lots of skills with rerolls, pass, dodge, that sort of thing. And I also don't give my guys catch.

[stashman]

Dark Elf Runner 80K/140K
7 3 4 7 Dump-Off, Pass, Accurate, Nerves of Steel


Elf Thrower 70K/130K
6 3 4 7 Pass, Accurate, Kick-Off Return, Safe Throw


High Elf Thrower 90K/150K
6 3 4 8 Pass, Safe Throw, Accurate, Kick-Off Return, Sure Hands


Wood Elf Thrower 90K/150K
7 3 4 7 Pass, Accurate, Sure Hands, Hail Mary

[Skipper]

Now don't take this answer too seriously.....

As a non-elf player, I'd say the best elven thrower is the one that was either just killed or causultied out of the game.

[Jural]

I rarely pass with my Dark Elves, and almost never throw beyond Short when I do... but I like having the viable threat to do so.

Also, I never use catch on my Dark Elves either... but on a runner paired with another runner I would consider it, since you may be trying to catch on an opponent's turn.

Actually, I haven't been using a Sure Hands player at all in my current league. No other speed teams and almost no Strip Ball. So the value is really minimized.

And my lifetime percentage with Dark Elves is also around 75%, all in leagues with mandatory OT. For whatever that matters.

[DoubleSkulls]

I'm generally late with sure hands since I like my line elves to pick up the ball & pass to the thrower for the SPP.

So I'll take Accurate & KoR first.

[mattgslater]

Actually, Ian, that's an argument for taking Catch over KoR.

[skatingtortoise]

i think with elf teams you have to weigh the cost of the lineman>thrower upgrade, with what youre getting.
a thrower's value in a team is only relevant when he is clearly superior at throwing, which with elves, can get hazy. (also with skaven)

personally, with pro elves, i miss out on a thrower in favour of 2 blitzers and as many catchers as i can get away with. the extra 2 Mv and NoS make them great at getting into/out of those tight situations.

later on in my league i will be getting a thrower, if only for the leader reroll

but to stay a little on topic, id say the best thrower is the welf one. the extra Mv makes a big difference over its rivals.

[DoubleSkulls]

Actually, Ian, that's an argument for taking Catch over KoR.

Very true. Accurate & Leader then