Bloodbowl mentality - please read

[Old Man Draco]

But it must succeed! This is exactly one chance in a million!

[Duke Jan]

OK, lets give a positive example of stalling. Like said it is a legit tactic but, you're both there to have a fun game. If you are going to stall for 6 turns you have about an hour you could have spent drinking beer at the bar with your opponent too.

I have enjoyed playing against stallers. Really, it is possible. You just make it a different game. I was playing wood elves and my opponent Khemri. I still had a war dancer and so was not without chance. The game changed to I steal your ball or you kill all my players. I ended the game with all players sitting in the KO or D&I box, but it was still fun.

I have also not enjoyed playing against stallers. This is when you have no realistic chance of reaching the ball carrier for 7 turns. In this game it's no longer a game, it's a check mate. In such a case do what chess players do if yhou have that mentallity, end the bloody game on a handshake and have a drink at the bar.

[DoubleSkulls]

There is a big difference in my mind between clock control to deny your opponent time to equalise or win, and stalling when you already have the game sown up and are just beating your opponent up. Normally the difference with the 2nd is that if you scored you'd go 2 TDs in front. I'd consider it particularlly represensible against a tier 2 or 3 team since that coach has chosen a fun option over a competitive one.

I think it sounds like there were unfortunately a larger than normal group who really missed the point - its a game for two people to enjoy. Make sure there is more beer and less aggro. Ask the idiots not to come again, or let them know they are on a yellow card if they do come.

[Igor Tahavanale]

I've still yet to see a single argument that would convince me that stalling is bad sportsmanship. I'd rather spend a game trying to break my opponents stalliing against a fun player than play some whinging sh#tbag who freely gives me the ball back but then queries every single bloody rule even when you showed them how the same thing worked last turn and the two turns before that, and out-dices you but still complains about their luck

I don't see an issue with it. Bloodbowl is a game with many teams and many playing styles as a result. Unless you ban bashy teams from a tourney then banning (or making out players are cheating or bad sports for stalling to guilt them out of it) a stall is completely unfair on those teams. All that argument does is lead to the eventual conclusion that every team should be 0-16 human linemen and a couple of re-rolls

[PubBowler]

I'm no problem with stalling and see more of it from agility teams.
Any good Wood Elf/Skaven coach knows this is a vital skill.

[Sallacious]

Scenario for you

You have a secret weapon on your team. They have a big guy. You really want that big guy gone. You are in position to score. It is turn 4 of the first half. Do you score and lose your secret weapon and allow that big guy to return or do you stall until you either take out that big guy, lose that secret weapon due to injury or lose that secret weaopn due to ejection from fouling and then score?

And for the record... although I am for stalling in some cases, stalling when your opponent is clearly outnumbered by alot is sad and unecessary especially if you are winning already.

[sann0638]

If you have played well enough (or are lucky enough) to be in a position to stall then good on you. If you play well (or are lucky) your opponent will not be able to stall.

Agree though that if scoring would put you ahead by 2, stalling makes you smelly

[Darkson]

Agree though that if scoring would put you ahead by 2, stalling makes you smelly

Not when you're facing 2 AG5 MA10 Sprint Gutter Runners (damn that Skaven team! ).

[sann0638]

Then you should have killed them already

[El Hombre]

wasn't intending on replying to this one, as me and my mates are rather new to the tournament circuit.

I must say, I've enjoyed every single one of my tournament games thus far; against 'better' and 'lesser' opponents; against joking and cheering ones, and hell even against one who was listening to his MP3-player. Haven't noticed anything of bad sportmanship thus far.

About the stalling. I do think it's a legal tactic given some situation. Face it: when you're drawing 1-1 and give a wood elf coach 2-3 turns against your orcs/dwarfs/elfs/whatever, you're screwed. You know it and he knows it. But indeed, there is a difference to be made between stalling 1-2 turns and 6-7 or even 8. And vs Woodies is a different matter than against goblins/halflings/... But to draw the line? I think a lot is due to the game, the time, the in-game-events before the stalling, the round, the 'importance' of the game, and not the least: your opponent. You can say you're not going to stall unless absolutely necessary, but then you'd have to define that...?

At the last tourney I attended there was a similar incident; a match went out of time, and the TO came next to the table counting time: each coach was given 2 mins to complete his turn. First coach (woodies I think) didn't manage to complete his turn within the 2 mins (he kept on playing, and scored a winning TD, although the TO had clearly said "stop"), so the TO didn't validate it and set the pieces back as they were at the 2 min stop. The other coach (skaven) seized the opportunity and scored the winning TD himself. With a lot of grumbling for result. A lot can be said about this too I think...

[brassman]

Agreed for AG5 MA10 Gutters, but if you re-read the context that Vigus wrote, you'll see that he was stalling vs a decimated stunty team...

Personally, I see the value of a stall, some teams have it as a primary tactic, but there is a BIG difference between tactically stalling and stalling vs an opponent who is already stomped into the ground. The latter tactic is just bad manners ESPECIALLY in a tournament such as the Border Brawl, which prides itself on its fun nature.

Personally, having played both Fantasy and 40K tournaments in the past, and having been thoroughly disgusted by the mentality of the players in both, I do not want to see Bloodbowl evolving this way (and no, it wasn't because I lost a lot or such, I actually was one of the better players).

Only once have I seen this mentality in Bloodbowl and it was a couple of years ago in EuroBowl vs a country I won't mention (cos its not important now). Apart from this, its been blissfull fun in Bloodbowl land and I intend to keep it this way, even if we have to deny some people access to tournaments. But lets hope that doesn't become necessary (and with people like Seb, Draco and Vigfus organising tournaments, I have faith in it tbh).

My 2cents

Sam

Agree though that if scoring would put you ahead by 2, stalling makes you smelly

Not when you're facing 2 AG5 MA10 Sprint Gutter Runners (damn that Skaven team! ).

[Buggrit]

Agree though that if scoring would put you ahead by 2, stalling makes you smelly

(could I call you a smelly hypocrite?! On reflection probably not.)

[sann0638]

I'll rise above that.

[TuernRedvenom]

Personally, I see the value of a stall, some teams have it as a primary tactic, but there is a BIG difference between tactically stalling and stalling vs an opponent who is already stomped into the ground. The latter tactic is just bad manners ESPECIALLY in a tournament such as the Border Brawl, which prides itself on its fun nature.

Quoted for truth!

[Sallacious]

Agreed for AG5 MA10 Gutters, but if you re-read the context that Vigus wrote, you'll see that he was stalling vs a decimated stunty team...

Agreed... that is lame!