Stand firm / Side step vs. Bone head / Hypnotic Gaze

[darkonion]

If you block a Bone Headed or Hypno-gazed guy (i.e. player with lost tackle zones), does his side step and stand firm function against a push result?

It would seem reasonable to me that they wouldn't work since they involve 'player choice', but I have been wrong before. I searched quite a bit and haven't seen a post regarding this... I am interested in the answer as it related to LRB 5.0.

Regards,

[GalakStarscraper]

Lost Tackle Zone only mean skills that use Tackle Zones don't work.

Side Step and Stand Firm do not need for the player to have a Tackle Zone in order to work so they still do work.

Compared to a skill like Guard where the player needs to have a Tackle Zone to work.

Galak

[Notorious_jtb]

I haven't seen this before either. But from my reading I would say you cannot side step because that is you "choosing to move" when you suffer from either bone head or hypnotic gaze as you may not voluntarily move when bone headed or hypnotised.

Stand firm makes no reference to choosing to move. In fact you are not moving. Therefore, I would say stand firm can be used.

I have highlighted the key passages in the skill quotes below



Bone-head (Extraordinary)
The player is not noted for his intelligence. Because of this you must roll
a D6 immediately after declaring an Action for the player, but before
taking the Action. On a roll of 1 they stand around trying to remember
what it is they’re meant to be doing. The player can’t do anything for the
turn, and the player’s team loses the declared Action for the turn. (So if a
Bone-head player declares a Blitz Action and rolls a 1, then the team
cannot declare another Blitz Action that turn.) The player loses his tackle
zones and may not catch, intercept or pass, assist another player on a
block or foul, or voluntarily move until he manages to roll a 2 or better at
the start of a future Action or the drive ends.

Hypnotic Gaze (Extraordinary)
The player has a powerful telepathic ability that he can use to stun an
opponent into immobility. The player may use hypnotic gaze at the end
of his Move Action on one opposing player who is in an adjacent square.
Make an Agility roll for the player with hypnotic gaze, with a -1 modifier
for each opposing tackle zone on the player with hypnotic gaze other
than the victim's. If the Agility roll is successful, then the opposing player
loses his tackle zones and may not catch, intercept or pass the ball,
assist another player on a block or foul, or move voluntarily until the start
of his next action or the drive ends. If the roll fails, then the hypnotic gaze
has no effect.

Stand Firm (Strength)
A player with this skill may choose to not be pushed back as the result of
a block. He may choose to ignore being pushed by ‘Pushed’ results, and
to have 'Knock-down' results knock the player down in the square where
he started. If a player is pushed back into a player with using Stand Firm
then neither player moves.


Side Step (Agility)
A player with this skill is an expert at stepping neatly out of the way of an
attacker. To represent this ability, his coach may choose which square
the player is moved to when he is pushed back,
rather than the opposing coach. Furthermore,
the coach may choose to move the player to
any adjacent square, not just the three squares
shown on the Push Back diagram. Note that the
player may not use this skill if there are no open
squares on the pitch adjacent to this player.
Note that the coach may choose which square
the player is moved to even if the player is
Knocked Down after the push back.

[tchatter]

Technically you aren't voluntarily moving when you use Side Step. You are being pushed back from the block.

Maybe Side Step should read:

Side Step (Agility)
A player with this skill is an expert at stepping neatly out of the way of an
attacker. To represent this ability, his coach may choose which square
the player is pushed to when he is pushed back,
rather than the opposing coach. Furthermore,
the coach may choose to push the player to
any adjacent square, not just the three squares
shown on the Push Back diagram. Note that the
player may not use this skill if there are no open
squares on the pitch adjacent to this player.
Note that the coach may choose which square
the player is pushed to even if the player is
Knocked Down after the push back.

[GalakStarscraper]

I haven't seen this before either. But from my reading I would say you cannot side step because that is you "choosing to move"

The answer is in the rulebook on page 61:

Q: Players under influence of Bone-head, Really Stupid, or Hypnotic Gaze cannot use skills that allow them to move voluntarily. Which skills are not allowed to be used as they are considered moving voluntarily?
A: Skills that allow you to leave your square without being forced to leave your square in the first place. These skills are Diving Tackle, Pass Block, and Shadowing.

[Notorious_jtb]

good responses.

I will let those coaches with side stepping Ogres choose their push back squares when they go bone headed in future

JTB