Slann - Who gets Strip Ball?

Ullis · Post by **Ullis** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:15 pm

The Slann team obviously needs someone with Strip Ball because it makes so much sense to leap into a cage to get a hit on the ball carrier. Strip Ball should also be complemented with Wrestle and maybe Tackle as a third skill.

But who should get these skills?

The catchers are superb at leaping, but they have only ST2.

The blitzers and linemen are ok leapers with 3+ leaps and both have ST3.

I've been thinking that it should be one of the blitzers who should be used in this role, but today it hit me that it should be one of the linemen instead. All the skills required are normal skills. Perhaps Mighty Blow would be an ok addition but it's just a bonus after stripping the ball.

The blitzers have MV7 versus MV6 for the linemen. Is this enough to justify using a blitzer? The blitzers can be so many other things than a goofy looking wardancer. They have GAS skill access (and they're super expensive too). Skilling up the blitzers is a bit easier because it's easier to score with them since they have MV7 and Jump Up.

Any thoughts on this?

Jimjimjimany · Post by **Jimjimjimany** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:22 pm

I've been using slann in a league and I gave strip ball to a lineman. Other than the MA 7 and jump up the blitzer has nothing that makes him better than a lineman for this job, and I don't think thats worth 50 added to your TV. With GAS access I'd be developing blitzers into a guard/sidestep role that the team lacks.

I wouldn't give it to a catcher, even though half dice blocks with strip ball can work, you have such an obvious strength 3 alternative.

tenwit · Post by **tenwit** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 8:54 pm

Best solution is to give it to two linemen. Keep them separate, you should be able to keep one within 6 of the ballcarrier and one within 6 of any possible catcher.

I'd suggest 2x Wrestle/Strip Ball/Tackle, in that order. It has worked very well for me. The linemen who get Wrestle go on the LoS until they skill up a 2nd time: there's some chance of CAS SPPs that way, and they can still get the occasional TD.

Doubles would be Guard if it's the 1st or 2nd skill (as it's useful on the LoS and in the opponent's cage) and Side Step if he already has Wrestle/Strip Ball. Stacks very nicely with Tackle.

one_second_of_insanity · Tue Mar 03, 2009 3:11 am

It definitely goes on the linemen. There are better skills available for the blitzers. I also agree that it should be placed on 2 linemen each with wrestle for their first skill, that way the ball is free on anything but a skull guaranteed.

Rabid_Bogscum · Post by **Rabid_Bogscum** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 5:08 am

would you take ss or sf on the blitzers?

Jural · Post by **Jural** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 10:13 am

Rabid_Bogscum wrote:would you take ss or sf on the blitzers?

Side Step in tabletop, but Stand Firm in PBeM. Side Step is almost always better, and few blitzing players have grab, whereas Juggernaut seems downright common. So Side Step works more often.

Johnny KTOU · Post by **Johnny KTOU** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 7:38 pm

I was going to say stand firm, it sounds better with diving tackle.

The problem with side step is that when they try to remove you from the ball carrier, it's quiet easy to fill the "holes" where you could go and still have the ball carrier in your TZ (and there are not many places when you're in the cage...)

On the contrary, with stand firm, you're not gonna move at all, so the opponent needs to put you down or must have juggernaut... And if he doesn't, he'll have to dodge or be blocked the next turn...

(I hope what I'm saying makes sense...)

Ullis · Post by **Ullis** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 12:50 pm

I'm bringing this thread back as stat increases made my life harder. I have the following players:

Slann blitzer with Block and +ST
Slann lineman with +AG
2 Slann linemen with Wrestle
2 Slann Catchers with Blodge

(the rest of the team is Kroxigor, another blitzer, 4 linemen)

My first idea was to give both Wrestle linemen Strip Ball on a normal roll and to give the blitzer (prior to rolling +ST) MB and Piling On.

What should I do now? The ST4 blitzer seems like a superb cagebreaking piece, for which reason I should give him Tackle and Strip Ball next(probably Strip Ball first) and I'm mainly concerned about defence anyway. Would Frenzy make sense for bringing people out of cages and being a general crowd surfing threat?

What do I do with the AG4 lineman? Block or Wrestle on a normal roll seems like a good idea. Doubles would be Guard to help with cage breaking.

What do I do with the catchers? Guard on doubles to assist in cage breaking, but what should I do on a normal roll?

Ikterus · Post by **Ikterus** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:10 pm

Catchers = Side Step! It's brilliant! Especially when forming a halfcage along the line <7 squares from the end zone.

Linemen (all mentioned incl the AG4 one) = Strip Ball, no contest. Guard on doubles.

Blitzer = Guard. You need it.

Ullis · Post by **Ullis** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:21 pm

Ikterus wrote:Catchers = Side Step! It's brilliant! Especially when forming a halfcage along the line <7 squares from the end zone.

Linemen (all mentioned incl the AG4 one) = Strip Ball, no contest. Guard on doubles.

Blitzer = Guard. You need it.

I don't know if I'm too focused on leaping into a cage to hit a ball carrier with 2-d, but I don't see how giving a (especially my ST4 blitzer) Guard helps there? That requires at least one AG3 leap and in many cases two.

The chances of making two AG3 leaps without a reroll (which I'd optimally like to conserve for picking up the ball once it's loose and at least have for the block) is only 45 %. I obviously have the option to abort the assault if my first leap roll fails but that's bad as then my Guard would either go splat or at least get hit next turn (if I use a reroll on the first leap), but that means I'd be aborting every third attempt, although my AG4 lineman has ok odds to go on with the attempt.

Anyway, if I give Guard to the ST4 blitzer, I'd actually be better off going in with him alone as a Guard+ST3 is ST4 as well.

Basically what I'm aiming at is, could you elaborate on why blitzers need Guard, especially in my case?

Ikterus · Post by **Ikterus** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:33 pm

True, true...

I stand corrected.

Guard is a god send in any Slann team. But as you point out the goal is to get a 2d block out of it, and this guy allready gives you that most of the time. He should get Strip Ball to maximise the effect of his S4.

My point is that since Blitzers are the only position that can get guard on a regular roll, you should give it to them as soon as possible. It also combines well with Diving Tackle.

Catchers with Guard are lovely as you point out. I'd choose Guard over Block any time on Catchers. Sure block keeps them alive but the threat of having a guard palyer leaping in on a 2+ makes your opponent think twice about forming a cage...

Blitzers are for me passive players that gives support and ties up opposisiton rather that gamemakers or hitters.

Edit: And I seldom use rerolls when picking the ball. A catcher with Sure Hands does that for me (and he has AG5

)

Ullis · Post by **Ullis** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:46 pm

I guess there's no getting around the fact that my ST4 blitzer (or any player with ST4 in a slann team) should be built with ball extracting in mind. I was just looking so much towards MB, Piling on, Frenzy and Tackle.

But will Strip Ball be the first skill to give him? Would Tackle or Frenzy be better? I guess Frenzy would be asking for trouble as I'd need to negate more assists and if there's two cage corners with Guard I'd be in trouble on the second block. I think Strip Ball sounds good as in many cases only ST3 ball carriers have Sure Hands anyway. Strip Ball would force the opponent to use the player with Sure Hands as a ball carrier and then I'd get the 2-d or at least a 1-d block.

SillySod · Post by **SillySod** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 4:35 pm

In general I give St4+ players tackle and never strip ball. This guys job is to get easier 2D blocks and 2D blocks are for whacking stuff down. He also has block which combos well with tackle while strip ball tends to combo best with wrestle.

I see two routes for this player...

1) tackle/MB/PO and turn him into a cool blitzer who maims stuff and gets rid of anyone foolish enough to take sure hands

2) sidestep/dodge/guard passive but still excellent

Jimjimjimany · Post by **Jimjimjimany** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:05 pm

I think the AG 4 lineman would be the best candidate for strip ball (after wrestle), so you would need the equivalent of two 2+’s to free up the ball against a S3 ball carrier. With his AG4 it shouldn’t be too difficult to get some skills with him either. I’d take frenzy or tackle on your +St player, for hitting ball carriers with sure hands (and anyone else for that matter).

I don't see a place in the team for a MB/PO player; you will win games through ball retrieval, not attrition.

tenwit · Post by **tenwit** » Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:47 pm

I'd give the AG4 guy Pass Block then build him around the assumption that he marks the opposition catcher (using PB to get to the catcher). Wrestle, Tackle, probably Strip Ball, Guard or Diving Tackle on doubles. You can make a catcher (maybe your fourth) the intercept threat (since he can get Catch on a normal skill), and make this guy the sweep. On offense, he can help move the ball a bit, but his primary job would still be to mark the agile opposition players.

The only other thing I can think for him is to make him your thrower, freeing up your catchers for more catchery-type roles. Block, Sure Hands, Kick-off Return, Pass on doubles. Actually, that sounds like a nice useful build, since AG4 makes him as good as a catcher at picking up balls that strip-ballers have knocked loose, but his extra ST and AV make him more robust (and thus better for leaping with).