Mult. Block, Pass Block, Kick, Grab

[Tripleskull]

If you declare the pro player kicking before the kick is made you may use pro to re-roll his distance + Direction die (both not either/or as they are one cast of the dice. (like 1d6 dodge or 3 blocking dice)

hmmm, no. Its not in a turn.

[daloonieshaman]

hmm yes
skills use like pro and catch are pointed out under the section KICK OFF. (It actually uses those two in the example)

[Tripleskull]

The exeption allowes you to use pro to reroll a failed catch roll:

A team re-roll may not be used for any catch roll when the
ball lands: however, players may use the Catch or Pro skill to try
to re-roll the catch roll

Or are you talking about something else?

[Darkson]

If you declare the pro player kicking before the kick is made you may use pro to re-roll his distance + Direction die (both not either/or as they are one cast of the dice. (like 1d6 dodge or 3 blocking dice)

No you can't. Where in the rules is there anything about nominating the kicker?
The scatter (direction and distance) is just something that "happens", and can only be modified by the Kick skill (as listed in it's description). No other skill can effect it.

That said, I like that as a house rule.

[daloonieshaman]

If you declare the pro player kicking before the kick is made you may use pro to re-roll his distance + Direction die (both not either/or as they are one cast of the dice. (like 1d6 dodge or 3 blocking dice)

No you can't. Where in the rules is there anything about nominating the kicker?
The scatter (direction and distance) is just something that "happens", and can only be modified by the Kick skill (as listed in it's description). No other skill can effect it.

That said, I like that as a house rule.

Quite the contrary
He is (or is not) using his Kick Skill, he is the active player and may apply his Pro if he chooses to.

[Darkson]

You don't nominate the kicker - nowhere in the rules does it ask you to nominate a kicker.
You MAY use the Kick skill, if the player with Kick is in a legal position, but you don't nominate him, and you don't activate him (if you get a Blitz, he can still omove, etc.).

THE KICK-OFF
After both teams have set up, the coach of the kicking team
places the ball in any square in the opponent’s half of the pitch,
including the opponent’s End Zone if he likes. The ball will then
scatter in a random direction. Using the Scatter template, roll the
eight-sided dice once for the direction of scatter, and then roll a
D6 to see how many squares the ball will go.

No "nominate kicker" there.

Kick (General)
The player is an expert at kicking the ball and can place the kick with
great precision. In order to use this skill the player must be set up on the
pitch when his team kicks off. The player may not be set up in either
wide zone or on the line of scrimmage. Only if all these conditions are
met is the player then allowed to take the kick-off. Because his kick is so
accurate, you may choose to halve the number of squares that the ball
scatters on kick-off, rounding any fractions down (i.e., 1 = 0, 2-3 = 1,
4-5 = 2, 6 = 3).

Nothing about the scatter, nor rerolling the distance there. All the Kick skill allows you do to is halve the result.

The scatter is a game mechanic, it isn't something that a player "does". It CANNOT be rerolled using ANY skill. It is an out-of-turn event, the same as an Apo.

[daloonieshaman]

yet you contradict yourself

..."Only if all these conditions are
met is the playethen allowed to take the kick-offr . Because his kick is so
accurate," ....

[Teydyn]

Pro (General)
A player with this skill is a hardened veteran. Such players are called professionals or Pros by other Blood Bowl players because they rarely make a mistake. Once per turn, a Pro is allowed to re-roll any one dice roll he has made other than Armour, Injury or Casualty, even if he is Prone or Stunned. However, before the re-roll may be made, his coach must roll a D6. On a roll of 4, 5 or 6 the re-roll may be made. On a roll of 1, 2 or 3 the original result stands and may not be re-rolled with a skill or team re-roll; however you can re-roll the Pro roll with a Team re-roll.

Maybe there is nothing on kickoff or kick, but there is something on Pro.
You can use Pro once per turn, Kick-Off is before the turn starts, so no Pro on Kick-Scatter.

Once the kick-off has been taken you are
ready to proceed to the first turn of the game.

This sentence shows kickoff is not IN a turn, but before.

[Darkson]

yet you contradict yourself

..."Only if all these conditions are
met is the playethen allowed to take the kick-offr . Because his kick is so
accurate," ....

So he can use the Kick skill - nowhere does it say he rolls the scatter dice.
If it is the kicker who rolls the scatter, why does the ball scatter at all if you only have 3 players to field, who are all on the LOS? None of them can take the kick. Are you also arguing if one of my players has Pro (but not Kick) I can still reroll the scatter?

[daloonieshaman]

I am just pointing out the wording the BBRC (or GW) used

[GalakStarscraper]

The scatter of a kickoff and direction are no different from a the scatter of an inaccurate pass.

You cannot use Pass or a re-roll to change the scatter of an inaccurate just the same as you cannot use Kick to change the direction or scatter.

These are effects outside of the player's skills.

Galak

[Tripleskull]

yet you contradict yourself

..."Only if all these conditions are
met is the playethen allowed to take the kick-offr . Because his kick is so
accurate," ....

Damn you are stubbern. Even more stubbern than wrong. No harm intended

Sit back for a second and think it over. If you follow this logic you should be allowed to reroll the kick off result with the kick, pro combo. The rules says nothing about the kick off result not being rerollable by skills...

You may not re-roll the result on the Kick-Off table with a team
re-roll.

[daloonieshaman]

Simple fix is have them alter, delete or add a few words here or there to clean up the whole lot with pro, kick, kick off, ect

[Xeterog]

There is a strange little secondary problem as well. Nowhere in the rulebook is the concept of a "turn" adequately defined (I believe).

If a turn were properly defined, it would be easier to know when Pro can be used. For example, I fail to pick-up the ball, therefore my turn ends, but can I then use Pro to catch the ensuing bouncing ball (I believe the BBRC would say yes, as would most coaches, but they would not need to make a ruling if the concept of "turn" were clearly defined - when it begins, when it ends).

My suggestion has been to have a glossary of terms in the rulebook for just such things. But I suspect the BBRC and JJ don't have an appetite for that sort of thing yet.

Hope this helps.

I'm confused a bit by this..pg 7 (The sequence of play) seems to define a turn fairly well to me...what is it missing?

[Tripleskull]

I can only see a list of players actions and a list of what ends a turn, not a definition of a turn or an explanation of when a turn ends.

So I would like to elaborate on the problem and ask: if a player used pro and failed to pick up the ball, can he then use pro to try and catch it, if it bounces back in his hands?