Can Mino WA can move b4 blitzing?

McSnaga · Post by **McSnaga** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 4:48 pm

Besides it's like the bull backing up to do a run up

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Fri Jan 10, 2003 5:29 pm

Deathwing wrote:As somebody points out on the BB forum, it makes Stand firm a pretty good choice on a double. If you fail the dodge, your action ends and you don't have to throw the Block. May come back to that situation where you want to fail the roll.

Fine by me. You just burnt your blitz action in this scenario AND the WA is still in it by the way since Stand Firm no longer lets you leave the square.

Really I have zero issue with allowing the WA to declare a blitz, dodge out, and then come back to complete the WA rule. I recommended it to Sean in his game vs the Pixies as a way to protect his two Rat Ogres from the 4 Treemen's Mighty Blow.

I think even with this gambit available that WA is still plenty negative and I have zero issue with it.

Galak

Ryk · Post by **Ryk** » Tue Feb 11, 2003 4:32 am

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"...if a standing Wild Animal is adjacent to a standing player from the opposing team then they must take either a Block or Blitz action, and throw a block at an adjacent player."

I'm wondering how the WA complies with the second part of the rule, "must ... throw a block at an adjacent player" on a (potentially) failed dodge?

In the WA rules, including the text above, there is also a rule stating that the WA must move first, and penalties associated (IP) with moving other players first.

A previous wording assigned these penalties to moving the WA "not first".

However, the ruling passed down from on high was that the imperative for the WA to move first was an absolute, penalties aside. That is, that non-WAs moving first would cause the game to stop, go back and the WA to be moved first.

I see no reason for a different ruling on the imperative "must ... throw a block at an adjacent player".

It is simply not possible to ensure compliance with this imperative by dodging out and returning for a block.

[The possible exception being moving (not dodging) away from a tackle zone-less Bonehead and returning for a block].

Although personally I am far from enamoured with the current rules on WA, I don't feel that there is much mileage to be had in trying to reduce their effects in this manner.

Ryk

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Tue Feb 11, 2003 5:50 am

According to how the rule is written, yes you can. According to what it's meant to say, no you can't. I'd never allow such a thing in my league. And the other guy is right, if you allow that, then all you need is stand firm and there will be no turnovers due to wild animal ever again.

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Tue Feb 11, 2003 6:28 am

I agree. Galak I don't think you are thinking about all the situations.

What about when I am 2 squares from the endzone? Don't you think it's lame that I could abuse the rule and avoid my WA negative trait?
The whole point of WA are situations where all you have to do is waltz into the end zone but instead you gotta throw that block first, roll a skull and blow your easy TD.

This is a lame cheat that needs to be nipped in the bud!

ZanzerTem · Post by **ZanzerTem** » Tue Feb 11, 2003 4:22 pm

Good point Pariah. the WA could declare a blitz, dodge out, and run into the endzone ending the turn and getting a score. Lame, and not the way it is supposed to work.

I also agree with Zombie. Never will it be like this in our league. When a WA takes his action, and is next to a player, that player is getting hit first, regardless of if it was declared a blitz or a block. Hit 1st, move next.

Ryk · Post by **Ryk** » Wed Feb 12, 2003 2:59 am

Bloodbasher Masher wrote:Good point Pariah. the WA could declare a blitz, dodge out, and run into the endzone ending the turn and getting a score. Lame, and not the way it is supposed to work.

Again, how does this comply with the "must ... throw a block at an adjacent player" part of the WA rules?

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Wed Feb 12, 2003 4:53 am

It doesn't.

Cervidal · Post by **Cervidal** » Wed Feb 12, 2003 5:04 am

As an abuse thing... a Rat Ogre is fairly likely to make his dodge out. A Minotaur isn't terribly unlikely, assuming no tacklezones will be hindering him.

As for Stand Firm negating this Wild Animal/blitz monkey-business, I would have no problem with that. That means my opponent just blew a doubles roll on Stand Firm, instead of Claw/RSF, Tentacles, or something else equally nasty on a Big Guy.

It may bend the spirit of the rule, but I see no real potential for abuse. Any player that could take advantage of this situation would be a problem, period, thanks to good skill rolling.

ZanzerTem · Post by **ZanzerTem** » Thu Feb 13, 2003 7:38 pm

Ryk wrote:
Bloodbasher Masher wrote:Good point Pariah. the WA could declare a blitz, dodge out, and run into the endzone ending the turn and getting a score. Lame, and not the way it is supposed to work.
Again, how does this comply with the "must ... throw a block at an adjacent player" part of the WA rules?

The entire reading in the LRB states "block or blitz", meaning that my above point is valid. Please do not quote incomplete sentences from the rulebook, it only confuses things.

Canbacon · Post by **Canbacon** » Wed Feb 19, 2003 8:44 am

[quote="Ryk"]

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"...if a standing Wild Animal is adjacent to a standing player from the opposing team then they must take either a Block or Blitz action, and throw a block at an adjacent player."

If I understand correctly, if a Wild Animal uses up his movement to stand next to an opponent, is he then forced to go for it as he MUST Blitz ? What happens if I don't declare a Blitz before moving next to an opponent? Must I back off one space, or do I even get called for an Illegal Proceedure? Must likely my league commis. will give me a kick in the arse for screwing around with the rules...

Post by **DoubleSkulls** » Wed Feb 19, 2003 9:51 am

Only if a WA is standing next to an opponent at the beginning of his action must he block or blitz.

So you don't have to block/blitz if prone or if you aren't adjacent to a standing opponent.

Bevan · Post by **Bevan** » Wed Feb 19, 2003 9:06 pm

Zombie wrote:.. if you allow that, then all you need is stand firm and there will be no turnovers due to wild animal ever again.

If the Wild Animal dodged away, and used Stand Firm to end the player's turn due to a failed dodge then the Wild Animal has failed to block the adjacent opponent. This must be a turnover, even though the failed dodge does not directly cause a turnover.

Dodging into the endzone with the ball, before blocking the opponent is harder to rule on, but I wouldn't allow the score to occur before the block has been made against the adjacent player. I would rule that it is a turnover if the Wild Animal carrying the ball attempted to move into the endzone because this would end the action before the block has been made.

So I think we can allow the Minotaur to take a runup as long as he doesn't end his action before completing the block.

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Wed Feb 19, 2003 9:20 pm

The problem is that this would make the rule a bit complex, and the general tendency right now is to streamline as much as possible.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Wed Feb 19, 2003 9:34 pm

Wild animal kinda implies to me that its a wild animal, not the sort of forward thinking kinda thing thats about to be thinking about dodging away first so he can get an easier block. Thats says more cunning than wild to me. I think he should have to do the block before moving, this also clears up any sort of other problem that might occur.