Skavens on D **Updated on Aug. 7**

[Carnis]

My MA 10 Runner rooled double 5. I go Sprint for sure or mutation ? This one, I have no clue.

Go +AG and go +MA (why would you even consider _sprint_ over +MA/double??). This way you'll have one to pickup at 2+ from nearly everywhere, and a oneturner, who doesnt need to go for it. Followup the OTT with block, sidestep and he'll be splendid in normal defence as well.

[plasmoid]

The catch is that MA can't be increased above 10 (AFAIK?)

[Carnis]

The catch is that MA can't be increased above 10 (AFAIK?)

And right you are. In LRB4 under the LRB4 java client MA could be as high as 12 (+MA, +MA, Very Long Legs). Apparently not in LRB5.. That situation never came up with us though. I would not take sprint over MA though, sidestep or use the double for a mutation (Very long legs? -> SS/Leap)

[Grumbledook]

actually max would have been 11 under LRB4 as each stat could only be increased by a max of 2

been like that since 3rd edition

all LRB5 added was making stats max out at 10

[Uldreg]

This is a great topic and has helped my skaven defense immensly. I am a relative noob and am wondering why everyone is so high on one turners on skaven teams. They can pretty mush score at will in 2 turns. Even a regular GR has a pretty good chance of scoring after a few chain pushes. Defensive runners seem like the only way to go. They are already so good at scoring, they really dont need any help at all. Also i am wondering about people inclinations towards defensive throwers. I think they fall into the same category as GR's. Build them defensively: Block, then accurate. After that defensive skills will help far more than any offensive skill you give them. And you can then play them both ways. This keeps you from having to 'protect' any players and all your players can be helpful, even if you are down to 5 men on the pitch ( as any skaven can tell you this will happen). Unlike being forced to field a one turner and your offensive thrower that have giant targets painted on their foreheads, and cant help very much on defense anyway...

[Jural]

One turners allow you to score in turn 8 after your opponent has held the ball for a whole half and only left you turn 8!

Otherwise, it's really good against elf teams where you can put the pressure on big time and wait for one of you to roll 1, 1 early in a turn

But yeah, the SKaven coach who scores in 1 turn every time just because he can is taking too many risks and not playing optimally, in my experience.

[Master Wang]

I played against a one turn wardancer a month or so ago and he had my (pro) elves shitting bricks as there was no where the ball was safe. So I'd agree that one turn runners could be a very useful defensive piece.

[Rewslaun]

I leave my one turn gutter runner on the bench and only bring him out if I'm receiving the ball on the 8th turn, I'm down a td or two and I need to make them up quickly or if I can't field enough other players on the pitch. Most of the time he stays in the reserve box the entire game. I like having him as an insurance policy...but I think I'd rather have 4 gutter runners on the pitch at all times. When he dies I think I'll let the one turn scorer role die with him.

[Wylder]

I can't understand the idea of having a runner who's job is to be benched for most/all turns in a match.

I field four runners every chance I get, and feel crippled if one ever goes out MNG. Runners are everything to skaven.

[Funksultan]

Agreed, keeping a valuable piece like a 1-turner on the bench seems crazy to me too. He can do so much on the field, I'd keep him in there, maybe with the exception if he's REALLY high on SPPs and the rest of your GRs need the passes/TDs to level up.

I'm still not sold on the 4 GR field though... I usually field either 2 or 3. If I don't have enough strength on the field to keep the opponent occupied, I find them surrounding and smashing my rats with a little more impudence than they should rightfully have. I mean, we're not GOBLINS. Give us a little respect!

2 GRs and a decent thrower, or 3 GRs, combined with the natural speed of all the other skaven usually gives me all the movement and scoring I need.

[mattgslater]

Field the guys you need to play your game.

Then field the guys you want to earn SPP with.

Then field your best guys, except maybe one or two specialists.

Then field 11 guys.

[voyagers_uk]

exactly, play the moment, then the match, then the league

after all, you could be hit by a bus or served with a C&D letter tomorrow

[Baduk]

exactly, play the moment, then the match, then the league

after all, you could be hit by a bus or served with a C&D letter tomorrow

oh boy, I sense a theme that might be here to stay

[Porkus_Maximus]

I've recently started playing skaven and this thread is full of useful advice. I'm currently attempting to play a pure matchmaking team in Cyanide's game, which means the league is perpetual and I have no control over my opponents, although the odds of running into dwarf/chaos/orc seem more likely at higher TV. If no one objects, I'd also like to use this thread to ask for advice and opinions on team development, especially the gutter runners. Skills in brackets () are skills I plan to take next. Injuries in bold.

GR: +MA, +ST, Horns (wrestle)
GR: +MA, Block (????)
GR : Wrestle, tackle (dauntless)
GR: Block, sidestep, diving tackle -AV (????)
SV: +AG, guard (mighty blow)
SV: Guard, mighty blow (tackle)
LR: Kick, block (fend)
LR: Wrestle, tackle -MA (fend)
LR: Block -AV (fend)
LR: Block (tackle) [1spp from skill up]
LR: Block (tackle)
LR: No skills (wrestle) [1spp from skill up]
LR: No skills (wrestle)
RO: Guard (stand firm) [1spp from skill up]

Team has 3 cheerleaders, 4 rerolls, apothecary, 10 fan factor and 280k in the bank. 195TV

Firstly, I've been made aware that wrestle is generally a superior choice to block on linerats, so I plan on developing any future players with that skill first. Secondly, I haven't had a thrower on the team yet as I have rarely faced many teams with strip ball. Ranked matchmaking does seem to be more bash-centric so strip ball is kept to a minimum although I have faced a couple of skaven teams that made use of it, and of course woodelves. Not sure whether it's worth developing a GR into a sure hands player, or simply buy 1 or possibly 2 throwers. My main concern with buying throwers is that while I can easily afford it, it would mean firing perfectly healthy and/or skilled players. Maybe replace my -AV and -MA linerats with throwers?

I've got at least 2 of my GRs as defensive players. I really regret giving the +MA player block instead of wrestle. Not really sure what to do with the block/SS/DT player, he's useful to have around but tends to get injured really easily with AV6. Tempted to fire him and start skilling a replacement ASAP.

So yeah, all advice/input/opinions welcomed.

[Ullis]

Nice +ST Gutter runner!

Anyway, I'd fire the -AV Gutter runner and hire a replacement. The jump from 7 to 6 is huge as suddenly an AV6 player is more likely than not to get hurt when knocked down. On a skaven team I think it's usually a firing offence to get -AV, but exceptions can be made. This guy has three normal skills which means that he's pretty expensive already. At the same time he's nothing special, even though I like the skill set. Optimal use of Diving Tackle and Side-step also means that you have to plonk him next to an opponent quite often which is not good given AV6.

How about taking a thrower and giving him Leader as first skill? That way you could shave off some TV and still get Sure Hands. I don't like giving Sure Hands to a GR as a defensive skill against Strip Ball as they're still only ST2 so a blitzing strip baller often gets two dice on them. Granted, it has an offensive use too in picking up stray balls.