would you turn down Stats if you had too many?

[Greyhound]

The reason why I ask is because my uber-orc team is loaded with AG+ (3 blitzers, 1 lino, 1thrower), has good ST upgrades (Lino, blitzer) and some speed increase (Thrower). I love it but if I roll more AG i'm not sure if I should take it.

Granted only 2 players have AG3 (discounting troll and BO) so it's highly unlikely but without dodge skill it feels like I should try more than 1 (or push comes to shove 2) AG rolls in a turn making the whole TV increase an expensive inducement-giving problem.

all the AG in the world does not help when I want to take Morg down because he's holding the ball and grinding his way on the pitch. It seems to me that there is a moment when you need to learn to say "no thank you very much" and take Guard/Mighty Blow/Stand Firm/Fend etc... all these skills which benefit the team hugely.

I am starting to be short of 'normal' players and meeting way too many Star Players. If it was the fancy SP with passing skill it'd be great but Morg I hate. We are at high TV and bash is king so I need some bench but with 12 players right now I feel a bit short.

I can't control my TV climbing up and up and up and up. Yes stats are efficient but facing Morg + fireballs + halfling chef makes the game extremely challenging (I have 4 RR because i don't have RR skill on all this AG4).

Do I embrace my curse and start developing Dauntless BO to take the ogre and accept he will always be there or try to limit my TV to force him out?

[Greyhound]

The reason why I ask is because my uber-orc team is loaded with AG+ (3 blitzers, 1 lino, 1thrower), has good ST upgrades (Lino, blitzer) and some speed increase (Thrower). I love it but if I roll more AG i'm not sure if I should take it.

Granted only 2 players have AG3 (discounting troll and BO) so it's highly unlikely but without dodge skill it feels like I should try more than 1 (or push comes to shove 2) AG rolls in a turn making the whole TV increase an expensive inducement-giving problem.

all the AG in the world does not help when I want to take Morg down because he's holding the ball and grinding his way on the pitch. It seems to me that there is a moment when you need to learn to say "no thank you very much" and take Guard/Mighty Blow/Stand Firm/Fend etc... all these skills which benefit the team hugely.

I am starting to be short of 'normal' players and meeting way too many Star Players. If it was the fancy SP with passing skill it'd be great but Morg I hate. We are at high TV and bash is king so I need some bench but with 12 players right now I feel a bit short.

I can't control my TV climbing up and up and up and up. Yes stats are efficient but facing Morg + fireballs + halfling chef makes the game extremely challenging (I have 4 RR because i don't have RR skill on all this AG4).

Do I embrace my curse and start developing Dauntless BO to take the ogre and accept he will always be there or try to limit my TV to force him out?

[Porkus_Maximus]

I'd be tempted to cut the +AG lino and the +MA thrower. The lino is an expensive novelty, I find that an Orc thrower with KOR is usually sufficient for getting to the ball and once it's caged you're unlikely to be moving more than 2-3 squares per turn. In that regard the +AG thrower might also be bloat, since a regular thrower with accurate tends to cover all my passing needs except in times of dire crisis. Yes AG3 and sure hands can still fail from time to time but it +AG really worth it on a thrower who will ideally only make 1-2 agility rolls per drive? I don't think so.

[mattgslater]

No way is a +AG Orc Thrower ever "bloat." I've had a few already. The guy is a game-changer!

[Smeborg]

Greyhound - your team is very fluffy and look like AV9 Elves! I would be inclined to emphasise their acquired difference, rather than tend towards an Orcy sameness.

All the best.

[Greyhound]

I'd be tempted to cut the +AG lino and the +MA thrower. The lino is an expensive novelty, I find that an Orc thrower with KOR is usually sufficient for getting to the ball and once it's caged you're unlikely to be moving more than 2-3 squares per turn. In that regard the +AG thrower might also be bloat, since a regular thrower with accurate tends to cover all my passing needs except in times of dire crisis. Yes AG3 and sure hands can still fail from time to time but it +AG really worth it on a thrower who will ideally only make 1-2 agility rolls per drive? I don't think so.

Well it's kinda funny, the +MA, KOR +AG thrower, is the same and only thrower. I had to fire the other normal thrower. The TV was getting way out of hands.

Same goes for the Block/Fend/AG Lino, that's kind of the purpose of the thread: what's a good lino?
Rookie: cheap but can't do a decent block
Block-Lino: maybe at its top
Block-Fend-Lino: great on the LOS and to accompany the troll
Block-Fend-AG-Lino: crap, do I fire and start again? edit: I love him, he is great to dodge and give assist and Fend means he's often unmarked to receive the pass and score.


Smeborg, I agree and I play them as such, but the lack of dodge skill means that they can't efficiently dodge like elfs, they do an amazing passing game but.... and I'm ashamed to admit it, they don't always win! Morg & Thorg takes the ball and... crap I can't stop him. I try 2 dice block against 4 or 5 times loosing orcs left and right while he walks down the pitch and score. I know inducement are subpar, but I feel like the team has gone too far with AG+/ST+ and I have 330k of TV worth in attributes, missing 8 skills on the team. So basically when I face a team with the same skills (but much less ST/AG than me) I'm actually conceding:
330k + 160k of missed "single skills" = 490k. This is not a whine, I love my team, I just don't know how to stop the TV spiralling up, I am contemplating giving up and just bench 1 or 2 more linos (up to 14 players), get 5 RR, and face M&T every game.



I thought the purpose of recycling players was meant to drop injuries and poor skill up, but when the skill up is right it's kind of becoming a TV bloat. The right balance is about... where is the right balance?

[Smurf]

Ignore ST as Wood Elves!? That seems like a bad idea. A S3 catcher or a S4... Anything else... Would be worth it indeed fr both defense and offense. On a treeman, I understand skipping the ST in favor of a doubles skill, but I would think that Strength increases would offset many of the difficulties WE have.

It's Smurf , read his playbook & you will or will not know the reason ;D.

Not just me Nazgob agrees that doubles are really important for the WE.

17 games in with my WE, 14 wins, the only doubles I have had is on 2 Throwers! Wardancers coming up to their 4 skills but not a double insight. Mind you one is the most violent non big guy in the league with 10 cas to his name... the big guy with the most is 13 cas over 14 games.

[Greyhound]

But but but if you are winning without the doubles... Why are they so important?

[Carnis]

Anybody advocating skipping strength in blood bowl with anything but a snotling needs to play another 200 games against some +ST players (of any team) and if they still hold that opinion, then come here and tell us "newbs" how they managed to "beat the +STs".

Basicly any +ST player breaks the intended game "balance" of said team, the team will be by default an overdog. And the 30k extratag for taking that +ST over a skill is *nothing* compared to the advantages.

[Smurf]

But but but if you are winning without the doubles... Why are they so important?

It's getting tough at the top and the grind machines can really hit into the style. With a few guards and Mightblows it would help even up the field a bit. I've already suprised some teams with Dauntless (Vampire and Norse).

I'm in the process of reshaping the team to fit the play. Lost 5 players in 17games and by the end of the season I may account for highest loss rate.

Circa the 200k TV there is a different dynamic to the game.

[Smurf]

Anybody advocating skipping strength in blood bowl with anything but a snotling needs to play another 200 games against some +ST players (of any team) and if they still hold that opinion, then come here and tell us "newbs" how they managed to "beat the +STs".

Basicly any +ST player breaks the intended game "balance" of said team, the team will be by default an overdog. And the 30k extratag for taking that +ST over a skill is *nothing* compared to the advantages.

Yeah, but my biggest problems are Pro and High Elves... they got sneaky skills. Orcs, Norse, Nurgle, Vampires are not a problem (accept a player who loses against me but has accounted for 5 of my loss players over 2 games - revenge on sunday one hopes, nurgle vs chaos hehehe).

PS did I tell you that my WE team after 17 games still doesn't have a TRR, thinking of getting one after the 20th game, but we will see how it goes.

[Carnis]

Anybody advocating skipping strength in blood bowl with anything but a snotling needs to play another 200 games against some +ST players (of any team) and if they still hold that opinion, then come here and tell us "newbs" how they managed to "beat the +STs".

Basicly any +ST player breaks the intended game "balance" of said team, the team will be by default an overdog. And the 30k extratag for taking that +ST over a skill is *nothing* compared to the advantages.

Yeah, but my biggest problems are Pro and High Elves... they got sneaky skills. Orcs, Norse, Nurgle, Vampires are not a problem (accept a player who loses against me but has accounted for 5 of my loss players over 2 games - revenge on sunday one hopes, nurgle vs chaos hehehe).

PS did I tell you that my WE team after 17 games still doesn't have a TRR, thinking of getting one after the 20th game, but we will see how it goes.

PLEASE register at fumbbl & I'll watch your replays and learn from the master! =)

[voyagers_uk]

Not sure I ever played a team where a Stat increase option would have been turned down.

I understand the arguements for and against, I just love me some organic growth

[Smurf]

Anybody advocating skipping strength in blood bowl with anything but a snotling needs to play another 200 games against some +ST players (of any team) and if they still hold that opinion, then come here and tell us "newbs" how they managed to "beat the +STs".

Basicly any +ST player breaks the intended game "balance" of said team, the team will be by default an overdog. And the 30k extratag for taking that +ST over a skill is *nothing* compared to the advantages.

Yeah, but my biggest problems are Pro and High Elves... they got sneaky skills. Orcs, Norse, Nurgle, Vampires are not a problem (accept a player who loses against me but has accounted for 5 of my loss players over 2 games - revenge on sunday one hopes, nurgle vs chaos hehehe).

PS did I tell you that my WE team after 17 games still doesn't have a TRR, thinking of getting one after the 20th game, but we will see how it goes.

PLEASE register at fumbbl & I'll watch your replays and learn from the master! =)

I don't know about master... but in the tournee I was in the Norse were surprised by my blocking game, they thought it would be dodge away, dodge away.

I think the next year's league is going to be more difficult, many of the coaches are now up to speed. A lot more skills being taken.

The interesting thing is watching the defence being set up, some are better than others and taking advantage of poor defence great.

I would like to register at fumbbl but I don't have time. I prefer playing it face to face anyway. If you're near Bristol we could link up.

[Funksultan]

With a few very very rare exceptions, I'll always take a stat increase. As others have said, they are just far too valuable to pass up.

Things like, +AV or +MV on say, a chaos warrior that doesn't have block yet? I can pass. +AG on a big guy who will probably never touch the ball? I can pass.

Take the stats and be thankful for em. Yes, I would ALWAYS take the +ST (well, excepting snots) and yes, I would definitely take a 2nd +agil on an elf lineman.