Witch elf +ag + st

[Anglakhel]

With Strength 4, she is going to be tough to take down, but with Block I would just send a Wrackler after her anyway.

STR 4 wracklers are extremely rare. STR 4 Blockers certainly aren't. Heck, even plain STR 4 Tackle players aren't all that common. Or are you banking on half die blitzes? In any case an opponent probably won't have tons of wrackle players. If you took wrestle on the witch your opponent doesn't even need Wrestle or Block to take you down: a rookie saurus/Black Orc/Beastman/... takes you down 1 chance out of 3 if he's willing to take a turnover!

Still, I realize it's a matter of personal opinion

Well, I do agree on this. I'm not saying Wrestle on this piece would be a waste. With Block she plays a different role nobody on the team can fulfill (unless you roll another STR+), and that's a big deal IMO. With wrestle she just becomes extremely good at a role another player in your team could be plain good at.
With my DE teams I rarely miss that super-duper take down star: I take Blodge and plenty of Side Step + a smattering of DT on the positionals and wrestle on the linemen. That tends to give me plenty of 2-die shots at the carrier if I am lucky enough to roll a doubles here and there for guard.

For the record: I take a lot of Wrestle and I think it's a great skill on the right players. I try to have at least 2 Wrackle players on every one of my teams. Yes it's underrated by some, but also overrated by some.

Ok. Here is where I think we have a philosophical difference.

I agree with you that not a lot of teams have Str 4 Wracklers or even Wrestlers for that matter. Like you said, Str 4 Killers or Ball Handlers with Block are even relatively common. Lots of teams field Block players with 4 Str, whether it's a player with a Str increase or a natural Str 4 player that's been developed for managing the ball (for example: one of the best teams in a PL I'm in has a CW with 4 Agility at he uses as a quarterback).

That is precisely why though that I would rather have a Str 4 Wrackler than a Str 4 Block WE or Ball Handler. I'm more concerned about where they place the ball when they have it. When they give the ball to their Str 4 beast, I want to know I have a player that can tear it loose and give me a shot at the loose ball. I can control who is holding the ball on my team the majority of the time. But most of the time I can't control who the enemy gives the ball to.

I play my Dark Elves to succeed at Defense first of all. The offense will tend to take care of itself with Agility 4 across the board. I want to set myself up to deal with all the Str 4+ Block players that most other teams will feature rather than Wrestle. I'm used to dealing with opponents that can almost always get 2d on my Ball Carrier if they get a shot at them. That's why DaE offense emphasizes screens and avoiding getting hit. We use Dump Off to keep the ball under control even when our Ball Carrier can't be protected.

I don't think we get that far trying to compete with other teams based on Str. I love Str 4 players when we get them. I'd happily take a Str 4 Blitzer for my own Str 4 Blodge Ball Carrier. But I think a Str 4 Witch Elf is a perfect opportunity to get a defensive piece that most teams simply won't ever have and won't be used to defending against, that being a Str 4 Wrestler and hopefully Wrackler at some point.

[Pagan]

I'd never take Wrestle on any Witch Elf, period. Since I commonly use them to Blitz, and if you don't continue moving your player after throwing the blocks it seems like you're missing something. Having Dodge means they generally will dodge away no problem unless they worked themselves into a bad cage area. In that case maybe you shouldn't have thrown that block.

Every time you use Wrestle on a blitz that is one less piece you have moving to assist on a block/tackle zone some squares.

The ground seems to be the place for the dregs of the team, not the stars.

[TuernRedvenom]

I play my Dark Elves to succeed at Defense first of all.

I play all of my teams to succeed at Defense first.

I don't think we get that far trying to compete with other teams based on Str.

Who ever said such a thing?

I don't think our philosophy is so very different. Not at all. I just value a player with exceptional stats to be built more like a generalist then a specialist (in this case sacker). With block she is still STR 4 and with Frenzy can still take on STR 4 ball carriers with pretty good success rates.
It's really simple, Block makes her worse at sacking but better at holding position/formation and blitzing non-critical targets. Wrestle is vice versa. I personally value the first more for a DE team. It's not a huge difference one way or the other.

[Smeborg]

Anglakhel - I agree with your "philosophy" of how to play DEs; others on this thread obviously do not.

I find this thread interesting for the sharpness of definition it reveals between those who like Wrestle on a Witch, and those who do not. For me, Wrestle is a skill which comes into its own when your opponent has the ball, and is best when given to specialist ball hunters. I find Wrestle to be an ideal skill on players with the following characteristics:

- Fast (MA7 or higher)
- Agile (AG4 or higher)
- AG skill access (for Dodge, Leap, Sidestep)
- G skill access (for Tackle)
- Starting skills include one or more of Dodge, Frenzy, Jump Up, Leap
- Player does not start with Block

I cannot think of a better candidate for Wrestle as first normal skill than a Witch (there are other good candidates, of course, such as Slann).

All the best.