Blodge Thrower with doubles: Strong Arm or Ignore?

[mattgslater]

http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=team& ... _id=647242

Player #2, Blargmarkh. In a different thread...

viewtopic.php?f=25&t=35053&p=618328#p618328

... I ruled out Sure Feet, Guard, and Side Step. That leaves me with Accurate (with the intent of getting Leader and Fend) or Strong Arm (with the intent of getting Accurate). He's at 31 SPP. The real question: is Accurate and Strong Arm so much better than Accurate and Leader or Accurate and Fend that I'm willing to go 10 games with -1 on QP attempts?

Poll closes at 6pm Sunday GMT, assuming two days means 48 hours. That's when I know I'm supposed to play.

[Carnis]

Posted this simultaneously with your change of thread..

With your freak blitzer the thrower is no good carrying the ball vs anything except ST3 strip ball leap teams (rare +no stats wood elves that is). Hence he has very little or no role in your team at all.

Keeping that in mind I think he has two options:

A) Man up the line - Guard (with blodge, he is more reliable & resilient than Block av9)

B) Become a oneturn option/thrower - Considering the MA8, AG4, Dodge ballcarrier receiver option I might actually consider skipping double for KICK OFF RETURN (Yeah, I didnt think I'd ever say this either!). Then followed by accurate later. MA5 thrower is just too slow for any OTT play, but with KOR he might be able to pull it off. After all you only need 3 LOS pushes (also grab on a BOB is not so far fetched in your gameplan later on).

There's also option C, sack him and replace with lino but considering he has blodge+sh-AV for just extra 70k I think A > C in any circumstance.

[mattgslater]

He's actually pretty useful. I like having two guys in my backfield.

There's no way he's getting line-duty. My defensive line is a thing of horrors: they make Nurgle and Chaos set up like elves. This guy's job on defense (he's a starter) is to capitalize on the loose ball that results from the offense having nowhere to go and nowhere to run to! When I lose games, it's almost always on offense.

Kickoff Return would be tempting, were it not for Jarromrolrg. MA8/AG4 more or less does the same thing. I also like the defensive utility of Accurate.

Thinking about it, Accurate, then Leader might be a lot stronger than Strong Arm, then Accurate. I'd save 10k TV for Leader over Strong Arm, then cut a TRR and save another 60k TV! So Strong Arm costs 70k TV when the day is done.

[MKL]

I was posting on the other thread...

Hi Matt

A bit late, I know, but want to chime in.

I'm too for a throwing skill, for two main reasons:
-You got the Ag4/Ma8 freak. Normally I'm not keen on “throwing” Orc Thrower, 'cause they lack a decent receiver, but you got a great one. A throwing game is viable.
-With Block, Dodge and S-Hands your Thrower is already a good runner. Any other skill (Fend, S-Step, S-Feet, etc.) does add something, but not so much really. A solid thrower open up a lot of avenues to a developed Orc.

As for the S-Arm/Accurate debate, I'm for S-Arm. It's a perpetual online league and you seem bent on “redeeming” your 18-8-11 record: you are in for the long term. Dare, and build for greatness

[Carnis]

There's no way he's getting line-duty. My defensive line is a thing of horrors: they make Nurgle and Chaos set up like elves.

Even though there's no way I'll believe your 2nd statement.. Just to be clear I didnt actually mean that line. Just the spam-block-guard line that ensues in blockwars over 2-3 turns after the initial set up. I'm not that sold on the whole idea that the setup turn is so crucial anyways.

With guard he'd be having a role similar to this guy more like it, being a mobile guard assist in an otherwise not so mobile team: http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=playe ... id=7782929

[mattgslater]

Yeah. I did think hard about that one. Guard is still rolling around in the back of my mind. Having 7x Guard (8 soon, if BOB #5 can get 5 more SPP) means I'll be unquestionably in control of the center action most of the time. The only concern is that I want to shore up where I'm weak, and that's controlling the ball in space.

Also, note that unlike Chaos Dwarfs, I have no shortage of mobile Guard. Of my six Guard players, two are MA6/AG3. I don't need doubles, and I don't need a skill on one of my superstars, to take Guard on a mobile piece. This piece is even more mobile, in that he has Dodge, but you know skilled 3+ rolls... that 1/9 comes up more than you'd think. Besides, he's AV8 and hard to replace.

Almost starting to lean to Accurate-Leader, even in the face of any and all doubles (though maybe not stats). But Guard sure is tempting. In that case, my sideline D would soon look like this:
g= Guard
s= SS/SF
b= Both
x= Neither

– – – –|– – b g b – –|– – – –
– b g –|g – – – – – g|– g s –
– – – –|– x – – – x –|– – – –

The Thrower would be the left flanker, just inside from Crogthnakk (4/4/2/9 Block/Guard/SS) and outside of a Guard Blitzer. Feels like overkill, but looks really pretty.

And yeah, I see 323 offensive lines all the time, even from teams that are used to mowing down line-sacrifices. All that Guard and Stand Firm seems to be daunting to many opponents. Standard practice seems to be: "line up a man to edge-block Drognarkh, put two guys in the 3 columns, blitz Drog's midfielder, then 2d Drognarkh and call it a turn." Almost never works, but even big scaries tend to go that way. The alternative is praying for pows, because one push and you're done making 2d hits.

[Chris]

Have you considered safe throw? I have yet to use it but I love the whole only fumble if roll a 1 thing...

[mattgslater]

The problem with Safe Throw on AG3 is that it's only 50%-75% to negate an interception (it's rare that I'd allow an attempt), and the other ability only works if you throw at a net penalty. If I take Accurate, I'd only ever throw at a penalty on a Long Bomb, and then it's still a 7/9 chance to deliver the ball downfield (8/9 if I don't use Pass on a 3-4; note that I would only throw a bomb on a T8 desperation play, where I don't care about fumbles vs inaccurate, or punts, where I would keep an inaccurate). So, a) I wouldn't use it much, and b) it wouldn't do me much good when I did, or at least wouldn't be reliable.

Accurate before Safe Throw, that's for sure. Strong Arm? Guard? I haven't ruled out either. But if I'm keeping him as a backfielder, I want to get Accurate ASAP.

The question really is, what's better? Accurate/Strong Arm (2+ long pass), Accurate/Leader (save 70k TV), or Accurate/Guard (multipurpose player)?

One more argument in favor of Accurate or Strong Arm: I have a Lineman with 3 SPP. He will get Block first, but then I'm thinking about Kick. That would take Blargmarkh off the field on defense, at least until somebody gets hurt. Mind you, if I get Guard on Blargmarkh, this Lineman will probably not see much action (except one offensive drive, of course) and could take forever to get Kick.

[Carnis]

And yeah, I see 323 offensive lines all the time, even from teams that are used to mowing down line-sacrifices. All that Guard and Stand Firm seems to be daunting to many opponents. Standard practice seems to be: "line up a man to edge-block Drognarkh, put two guys in the 3 columns, blitz Drog's midfielder, then 2d Drognarkh and call it a turn." Almost never works, but even big scaries tend to go that way. The alternative is praying for pows, because one push and you're done making 2d hits.

Yeah, though ranked doesnt really have the ashy teams in it, cause all the pickers wont give them games anyways . It looks very solid, let's hope we get matched with my B nurgle in The Fumbbl Cup this year.

[Chris]

I can't find a place on the field for linemen given my love of goblins, so the thrower has ended up with kick.

[mattgslater]

I can't find a place on the field for linemen given my love of goblins, so the thrower has ended up with kick.

Yeah, I got a team like that too. Not a Thrower with Kick, but Gobs instead of Linemen.

http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=team& ... _id=669918

[mattgslater]

Yeah, though ranked doesnt really have the ashy teams in it, cause all the pickers wont give them games anyways .

I often see 3-5 ClawMB players, or 2 POMBers. BattleLore's teams, in particular, scare me... though they really haven't done much damage to my Orcs. I've been mowed down to the tune of about 4 losses and 2-3 ties over that span, and taken a lot more turnover than I would have in older rulesets. That said, I've got a contingency plan for any one or two losses, with only a few guys that I couldn't lose without significant strategic changes (Jarromrolrg, Horkadakk, Crogthnakk, or two of Karkagragraghkkh, Fnorgrerm, and Drognarkh).

I generally don't get PO'ed without Claw unless the drive is already under control, except on Turn 1: Once I've moved my bodies into contact, you need every zone you can get. ClawMB has done some real damage to the team, but it's the kind of damage that can be rebuilt. I usually use the Apoth to save a KO against Dwarfs or Humans (incl Norse), and save it for something bad against chaotics, for that reason.

It looks very solid, let's hope we get matched with my B nurgle in The Fumbbl Cup this year.

Ooh... when is that?

[mattgslater]

Took Strong Arm. Not at all convinced it was the best choice, but the idea of 2+ Short Passes is hard to ignore.

[mattgslater]

Bloody 1-0 win over Malmir's Chaos team breaks my personal losing streak at 2 games (whew), and extends the Wildsquigz' win streak to 8 games. Now, at 19-8-11, the Wildsquigz have for just the second time met my personal benchmark of acceptability, at W≥L+T. They'll need to extend their streak to stay there.

http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=match&id=3208809

Bloody, bloody, bloody. But most of the blood was his.

Next up, Hitonagashi's Lizardmen.

http://fumbbl.com/FUMBBL.php?page=team& ... _id=323935

[RogueThirteen]

I certainly wouldn't both with Leader as a fourth skill. I'd take it as a first or second skill or not at all on any piece. By the time this guy finally hits his fourth skill, odds are your team will be skilled enough to not need a terrible amount of rerolls plus you'll have mountains of cash sitting around if you really want more.