Dark Elves TV110 for Brassbowl

[the.tok]

Hi everybody,

I'm going to Brassbowl in december, and I am planning to play Dark Elves there.

The thing is I have very little experience with them in LRB6. They were my first team in 3ed though and played them a lot in LRB4 too but they have changed quite a bit...

Anyway, I was considering this build

4 Blitzers
2 Witches
1 Assassin
4 Linelves

2RR
1CL

I can take 3 normal skills on day one, so I would have gone:
Block on Witch #1
Wrestle on Witch #2
Dodge on a Blitzer #1

For day 2, I can take 2 normals + 1 double:
Dodge on Blitzer #2
Dodge on Blitzer #3
Guard on Blitzer #4

I playtested this setup against Norse twice, for 1 win 3-1 and a draw 1-1 (with 4 failed pick-up attempts and a failed GFI in the end zone on turn 16 ) so thought it went quite well.

The wrestle Witch was quite outstanding in those games. Frenzy + wrestle + jump up is nasty, especially against block heavy teams like norse.

I am not very sold on the two new positionnals, runner and assassin don't seem very good positionnals, but maybe I'm missing something.

last note is I was short on RR, relying on them to play the ball, 2 is not enough, but I can't fit the 3RR into 110kGP


So the questions I have:

What do you guys think of this setup?
Wrestle on 1 or 2 Witches? it seemed really effective, but they were norse...
Any way to fit the 3RR ?
What is the point of the runner ?
for the last 10k : CL, or FF?
any other thoughts?

any advice will be appreciated

thanks!

[garion]

I would drop the assassin for a runner the extra Ma makes a big difference. Dump off is also a very nice skill to have in a rookie team, it just makes it that much harder to get the ball off you, it is also a nice skill to have on defence as well - pick up a loose ball and even if you cant get to saftey and get blitzed the following turn you have a chance of Dumping it off to one of your other players.

Also if you take a runner you can give him the Leader skill which gives you a 3rd Re-roll

I would go

Day 1
Witch Elf - Wrestle
Witch Elf - Block
Runner - Leader

Day 2
Dodge on Blitzer #2
Dodge on Blitzer #3
Guard on Blitzer #4

The runner also gives you and extra 10k to spend and I would put your free 20k in to FF personally.

[KFoged]

I will go;

3 Blitzer
2 Witch
1 Runner
5 lineelfs
2 rr
1 apo

I really really like the "new" apo as you can use it on a KO and that really really saves you a lot when you only have 3 really good players on day 1.

Day 1)
Dodge Blitzer
Wrestle Witch
Block Witch

Day 2)
Dodge Blitzer
Guard/Dodge Blitzer
Leader Runner

KFoged

[garion]

Yeah I like Kfoged's better, though I might be tempted to take eader from the start instead of block on a witch elf or dodge on the dark elf.

[KFoged]

Yeah I like Kfoged's better, though I might be tempted to take eader from the start instead of block on a witch elf or dodge on the dark elf.

I know the felling, but I find the dodge skill to save more than 1 rr when you only have 3 skills on the team. Better blocker, better ballcarrier - just plain better

I just played NAF WC with that setup and their i first took leader on day 3 - and not really missed that 1 rr. If anything in some games I had needed about 4-6

[garion]

Yeah I like Kfoged's better, though I might be tempted to take eader from the start instead of block on a witch elf or dodge on the dark elf.

I know the felling, but I find the dodge skill to save more than 1 rr when you only have 3 skills on the team. Better blocker, better ballcarrier - just plain better

I just played NAF WC with that setup and their i first took leader on day 3 - and not really missed that 1 rr. If anything in some games I had needed about 4-6

Lol true, I guess it depends how many dwarf teams and Chaos dwarf teams you might be facing. If you are expecting lots of power gamers Dodge may not be so useful

[KFoged]

Yeah I like Kfoged's better, though I might be tempted to take eader from the start instead of block on a witch elf or dodge on the dark elf.

I know the felling, but I find the dodge skill to save more than 1 rr when you only have 3 skills on the team. Better blocker, better ballcarrier - just plain better

I just played NAF WC with that setup and their i first took leader on day 3 - and not really missed that 1 rr. If anything in some games I had needed about 4-6

Lol true, I guess it depends how many dwarf teams and Chaos dwarf teams you might be facing. If you are expecting lots of power gamers Dodge may not be so useful

[the.tok]

I'm really surprised at your setup

I hadn't even considered dark elves could be played without 4 blitzers

do you really think the apo is worth dropping a blitzer?

I'm with you on the dodge blitzer on day 1.
Blodge AG4 player is gold.
The blodge blitzer is a pain for any tackle light team (that is anyone taller than 1m20 ^^).
In the playtest, he caught a bouncing ball, norse spent 4 block trying to bring him down, just to see him fly away to the TD on the following turn

Anyway, I am prepared to get crushed by dwarves

I will give another try to the runner as you all seem to find him much more valuable than the assassin. I thought they were both useless but at least the assassin was fun
But taking leader on day 2 is indeed a good argument. That and MA7. Just, I don't like dump off without NoS. It just fells so risky to me

Any advice on how to use it? on offense? defense? I feel so much more secure if a blodger has the ball...

I tried once to give it to him, and he fumbled the dump-off

[KFoged]

I'm really surprised at your setup

I hadn't even considered dark elves could be played without 4 blitzers

do you really think the apo is worth dropping a blitzer?

I'm with you on the dodge blitzer on day 1.
Blodge AG4 player is gold.
The blodge blitzer is a pain for any tackle light team (that is anyone taller than 1m20 ^^).
In the playtest, he caught a bouncing ball, norse spent 4 block trying to bring him down, just to see him fly away to the TD on the following turn

Anyway, I am prepared to get crushed by dwarves

I will give another try to the runner as you all seem to find him much more valuable than the assassin. I thought they were both useless but at least the assassin was fun
But taking leader on day 2 is indeed a good argument. That and MA7. Just, I don't like dump off without NoS. It just fells so risky to me

Any advice on how to use it? on offense? defense? I feel so much more secure if a blodger has the ball...

I tried once to give it to him, and he fumbled the dump-off

My goal with DE is to win every game 1-0 and then KO's on skill'ed players tend to hurt a lot, so I rather save a witch than have a 4th blitzer with just block. I can understand why people take the 4th blitzer instead but saving KO's is just so good a option to have.

On offense I use him as a decoy and to make assists against teams with no to little tackle, but when dodge seems to be pointless on the ballcarrier i will use him and hope not to be in any need for using dump off

On defense is their two options to send him ball hunting with a blitzer/witch (to be the assist) or keep him back and use the ma7 to put him where you need a little help.

I actually thinking about coming down for Brassbowl my self, but looks like I have to wait to next year

KFoged

[JaM]

Dump off is icing on the cake. He's quite good with MA7 and AG4.

Dont use an assassin, his AV is too low (7), and his shadowing just isnt... MA6 is not enough.
He'll probably be used as a low-armoured linemen and get KO-ed or CAS-ed. A normal lineelf is way better.

[the.tok]

Thanks for the advices, I think you guys more or less convinced me about the runner.

During the playtests, I found both the assassin and the runner to be kind of useless.
As it was VS Norse, I was biaised towards the assassin, thinking he could at least KO someone, but really he's too random. And I can imagine against orcs or other AV9 teams....


Well, I still think they are both kind of useless now, but at least the runner is 7MA, and he can get leader . But I'm a on the edge of going with a linelf honestly


About dropping a blitzer, I can see your argument and it is a sensible one. I will give it a try, but I love blitzers so much... they are fantastic player so having 4 + 2 witches is something I find hard to reject.
But with such expensive players, you're probably right, the apo makes sense. It is probably better.


I will do some more playtests this weekend, trying to see if I can find a use for the runner... and learn how to use dump off effectively.

[Smeborg]

During the playtests, I found both the assassin and the runner to be kind of useless.

That is a correct assessment. However, the value of a Leader caddy should not be underestimated.

I played against the highest ranked DE coach in the world recently at the World Cup, which was TV110. He took 4 Blitzers, 2 Witches, a Thrower and an Assassin. No attempt was made to use the Thrower for ball handling, he was there solely for Leader. The Assassin made 1 Stab attempt in the game (on the LoS on turn 1) - it failed. After that, he played as a Lino. Presumably the Assassin was there mainly for the AV7 teams (Woodies, Skaven, 'Zon).

I think you should always take 4 Blitzers and 2 Witches if you can. They are the main strength and point of difference for DEs, especially in tourneys. They are all potential Blodgers/Wrodgers at 1 skill.

Good luck.

[the.tok]

Well I think I decided to go in between all this great advices :

4 Blitzers (cause they're awesome)
2 Witches
1 Runner
4 Linelves
2RR
1 AC

Skills Day one :
Block on W1
Wrestle on W2
Dodge on B1

Skills day 2:
Leader on R
Dodge on B2
Guard on B3

I will take the risk of going without an apo and praise nuffle

See you at Brassbowl!

[KFoged]

Well I think I decided to go in between all this great advices :

4 Blitzers (cause they're awesome)
2 Witches
1 Runner
4 Linelves
2RR
1 AC

Skills Day one :
Block on W1
Wrestle on W2
Dodge on B1

Skills day 2:
Leader on R
Dodge on B2
Guard on B3

I will take the risk of going without an apo and praise nuffle

See you at Brassbowl!

Good luck - i still really like the KO option with the Apo, but hey 4 blitzere are nice

[Doowa]

Since there's some good DE skill discussions in this thread and the format with TV110 and 2x3 skills is the same I'm thinking about, I'll post here.

I like the setup with 2 witches, 4 Blitzers and a runner as Leader-caddy, though I can easily follow KFoged's argument for the apo. (Bringing DE to the Danish Championship, KFoged? )

My thought/ question is if there might be a better option then Guard on the double roll? I'm keen on just taking Dodge on as many Blitzers as possible and forget the double. But what about the witches? Wrestle on 1 is a lock IMO, but what about using a double on the second witch? Juggernaught? SF? MB? ..?
Also, I tend to see and hear ppl taking block on 1 witch and wrestle on the other. Why not wrestle on both? It seems better and more versatile then block, so why not take it on both?